How to Find SAINT TMS
The Carlat Psychiatry Podcast
Pocket Psychiatry: A Carlat Podcast
4.7 • 524 Ratings
🗓️ 1 December 2025
⏱️ 16 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
SAINT TMS is now available. We take a closer look at its record-breaking effect size.
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Published On: 12/01/2025
Duration: 16 minutes, 04 seconds
Chris Aiken, MD and Kellie Newsome, PMHNP have disclosed no relevant financial or other interests in any commercial companies pertaining to this educational activity.
Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | Call it S&T. |
| 0:01.5 | Call it Saint. |
| 0:02.7 | But who do you call when your patient needs this intervention for depression? |
| 0:10.5 | Welcome to the Carlet Psychiatry Podcast, keeping psychiatry honest since 2003. |
| 0:16.3 | I'm Chris Aiken, the editor-in-chief of the Carlat's Psychiatry Report. |
| 0:20.1 | And I'm Kelly Newsom, a psychiatric MP and a dedicated reader of every issue. |
| 0:27.4 | Last week, we learned that SNT-TMS brings 80% of patients to full remission, even after |
| 0:34.4 | 3 to 7 failed antidepressant trials. |
| 0:37.2 | But we still have questions like, |
| 0:39.4 | how does it work, how long does it last, and how do you find it for your patients? |
| 0:52.8 | TMS uses magnetic pulses to change the electrical rhythms of the brain. |
| 0:57.5 | That's called neuromodulation. |
| 0:59.7 | If you want a more poetic version of that, rewind to our November 3rd episode where Owen Muir |
| 1:05.0 | compares it to music, good memories, and psychotherapy. |
| 1:09.3 | All of these things change the brain's rhythm in ways that change us, that can lead to new learning. |
| 1:15.3 | And learning is what the brain is doing in TMS. |
| 1:18.1 | It's learning how to not be depressed, or to not have OCD, or not want to smoke any more cigarettes. |
| 1:24.8 | So when Nolan Williams set out to improve on this treatment, he looked back on |
| 1:28.9 | how he learned as he crammed for college exams. We've known for some time based off of |
| 1:34.8 | space learning theory that you can't kind of load a bunch of information to the brain without breaks. |
| 1:41.2 | The brain needs breaks in order to produce proteins to strengthen dendritic spines |
| 1:46.6 | and make longer-term effects. And so there's been basic science experiments showing |
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