How to Emigrate as a Throuple
How To! with Mike Pesca
Peach Fish Projects
4.3 • 2K Ratings
🗓️ 24 February 2026
⏱️ 41 minutes
🧾️ Download transcript
Summary
Dan Savage has built a legendary career giving sex and relationship advice, but as the U.S. political climate shifts, he's yearning to chase a very different dream: relocating his polyamorous family to Europe. He knows how to navigate complex relationship dynamics, but the leap to untangling international immigration law feels intimidating and technically out of reach. On this episode: How To! with Mike Pesca consults Charley Nieuwesteeg, a Dutch immigration lawyer specializing in the Dutch-American Friendship Treaty (DAFT). Charley offers Dan guidance on bypassing the bureaucratic hurdles to establish residency, navigating the logistics of "daisy-chain" migration—and why proving a romantic relationship to the Dutch government is surprisingly straightforward.
Executive Producer Corey Wara
Edited by Geoff Craig
Booking by Lya Yanne
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Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | Honestly, I've seen dog walking businesses and I've seen donut shops, very American. I've seen it all. You've got to open the banana stand to prove that there's residency permits in the banana stand. Welcome to how-to. I'm Mike Pesca. A friend of mine was saying to me, I'm thinking of moving to Harlem and I say, oh, that's great. You know, you hop on the two, three, You're there, you know, in minutes from Midtown, no problem. And she said, no, add an A. I'm like, ah, yes, the A trade. Columbus Circle, 125th. That's even better. No, she said, add an A to Harlem, not the Harlem here in New York, the Harlem in the Netherlands. I'm thinking of emigrating to the Netherlands. |
| 0:39.7 | And I get it. I got it. A lot of people are, given that the U.S. has turned into, I don't know, |
| 0:46.0 | a bit of a nightmare of immigration crackdowns, judicial overreach. And even without the |
| 0:51.7 | current administration, just the background constant of a little bit |
| 0:55.7 | of crime, a lot of cars, a dearth of clogs. The Netherlands does beckon. I can see it. |
| 1:03.3 | I'm Dan Savage. I'm the author of the long-running sex advice column Savage Love host of the long-running |
| 1:08.8 | sex advice podcast, The Savage Lovecast. |
| 1:11.6 | And I think about emigrating every waking moment for all sorts of different reasons. |
| 1:17.9 | Hello, Dan. How are you? I'm good, Mike. How are you? It's good to see you. |
| 1:21.6 | I'm good. Now, I'm thinking of staying. I'm committed to this land and these people. But I want |
| 1:26.9 | you to talk me through what |
| 1:29.5 | you've been thinking about, why, and then we'll get into the fun, delicious intricacies of your |
| 1:35.0 | particular arrangement. |
| 1:36.5 | Well, I've been married for a very long time to an American citizen, and we live and own a home |
| 1:42.5 | in Seattle. |
| 1:43.9 | But we are in a longstanding open relationship that evolved into a polyamorous relationship. |
| 1:48.0 | And my husband has a boyfriend and I have a boyfriend. |
| 1:52.0 | My boyfriend is an EU national, an EU citizen. |
| 1:58.0 | And so I go to see him as often as I can, but I can only go three months at a time |
| 2:02.7 | on a U.S. tourist visa. And I would like to be able to be there longer than three months. |
| 2:10.5 | And my husband and I have, we travel to Europe a lot. He travels to Europe a lot. We have a lot of |
| 2:14.4 | friends in Europe. And it's sort of a combo of, you know, it would be nice. We would like to live in Europe a lot. We have a lot of friends in Europe. And it's sort of a combo of, you know, |
... |
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