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Hard Knox with Amanda Knox

How to Be Good Without Being Boring (Dessa)

Hard Knox with Amanda Knox

Knox Robinson Productions

True Crime, Mental Health, Health & Fitness, Society & Culture

4.61.1K Ratings

🗓️ 12 August 2025

⏱️ 74 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Dessa is a genre-defying rapper, writer, poet and thinker. In this sharp and witty conversation she talks with Amanda about why being a “good person” so much messier than it sounds, moral hangovers, the science of heartbreak, and what it means to live thoughtfully in a world that rewards hot takes and hustle. Reach out to us at ⁠⁠⁠⁠www.amandaknox.com⁠⁠⁠ ⁠or ⁠⁠⁠⁠amandaknox.substack.com⁠⁠⁠⁠ X: @amandaknox IG: @amamaknox Bluesky: @⁠⁠amandaknox.com⁠⁠ ⁠⁠ ⁠⁠Free: My Search for Meaning⁠⁠⁠ Waking Up Meditation App⁠https://www.wakingup.com/Amandaknox Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

For ad-free episodes of Hard Knocks, subscribe at Amandanox.substack.com, where you'll also find access to essays, bonus episodes, and more. Enjoy.

0:15.5

I'm Amanda Knox, and you're listening to Hard Knocks.

0:20.0

Music Amanda Knox, and you're listening to Hard Knox.

0:29.6

My name is Dessa, and I'm a writer and a musician.

0:34.8

So for me, the kind of entry into performance wasn't like in school band or in choir.

0:39.5

It was afterwards, I was like a lonely, sad girl kind of vibes in high school, and I ended up joining a rap crew that toured for kind of on it off and fits and starts

0:47.8

for, you know, something like 20 years of my life. Yeah. I love that. I love how, um,

0:54.1

it's not like you were there studying music.

0:56.5

You were being like a philosophy girl and then who just happened to know how to express

1:03.5

herself in rap terms.

1:06.6

That's an interesting, you know, intersection of talents.

1:11.8

I don't know how your experience has been, like, as a creative person in the world.

1:16.2

But for me, I think I have never been an artist who's like, God, what a great day.

1:22.5

You know what I want to do?

1:23.7

Take up a guitar.

1:25.6

And in part, because I don't play guitar.

1:27.5

But even if I did, for me, I think very often, like music and art comes out of a feeling of disorientation, distress, conflict.

1:36.8

That's the reason for it.

1:37.8

If you're having a freaking awesome Wednesday, then you just Wednesday.

1:41.7

There's no need, do you know what I mean?

1:43.7

There's no need to bring out the heavy machinery to figure out what the hell is happening

1:47.5

to your human single life.

...

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