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The Daily Beast Podcast

How the Epstein Files Backfired on Trump: Wolff

The Daily Beast Podcast

The Daily Beast

News & Politics

4.6 • 7.9K Ratings

🗓️ 24 December 2025

⏱️ 62 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Michael Wolff joins Joanna Coles to unpack why the release of the Epstein files has backfired on Donald Trump, obscuring key facts while amplifying the one question that won’t go away: what Trump knew, and when. Wolff explains how the chaotic document dump fits Trump’s flood-the-zone instincts, while Coles probes how branding, spectacle, and confusion remain his core political defenses. They also examine the risks of sidelining institutions—from Ukraine diplomacy to ICE-as-content—and ask whether Trump’s belief that chaos protects him is finally working against him.

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Transcript

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0:00.0

The Epstein file turns out to be a funnel of everything undifferentiated.

0:06.5

So the file is essentially a garbage can of everything mentioning Jeffrey Epstein.

0:13.8

How do we obscure what we don't want to see?

0:16.9

Well, then we give you too much.

0:18.2

So rather than solve the mystery, it increases the mystery.

0:26.2

Michael Wolfe.

0:30.5

Joanna Coles, two days before Christmas.

0:33.5

Two days before Christmas.

0:35.2

Have you got all your shopping done?

0:38.2

You can always do more.

0:40.7

Oh, it's a good American attitude towards shopping.

0:44.5

I have done almost none.

0:46.3

I'm only buying a very few gifts this year, and I went to one store, and I bought them all there.

0:51.0

I suddenly thought, why not?

0:52.9

So, Gigi Hadid, if you're listening, I bought

0:55.0

everything from guest in residence this year. Everybody's getting cashmere. Done. Is that,

1:00.0

is that her store? I like that store too. That's so, yeah, it's good. Cardigan store.

1:06.3

Cardigan store. It's right around the corner from me. So I strolled out on Saturday and I ended up buying

1:12.6

everything there. And also they come in very nice yellow boxes, which is cheerful for this time of

1:17.4

year. So all your boys are getting cardigans? Well, they do sweaters too. Actually, the younger son is not

1:25.0

getting Kashmir. He is getting an enormous pot because he likes to cook.

1:31.6

And if he doesn't want it, I've told him I'll take it back from him.

...

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