How many McKinsey employees or former employees have you spoken with?

I haven't counted.

Yeah, I mean, a lot.

Ian McDougall reports for ProPublica.

Is there a type?

I don't think so necessarily.

There is a type of, I think, true believer there.

He spent the last year or so examining the inner workings of this one very prominent

consulting firm, which has found itself suddenly thrust into the middle of the presidential race.

The true believer type is actually quite a bit like, I think, at least the stereotypes of

Pete Buttigieg.

Pete Buttigieg is one of McKinsey's most prominent alums.

You know, has a fairly technocratic attitude, believes that problems are fixableable and believes in the virtue of smart people

putting their minds to tough problems and fixing them. And that's not necessarily a bad thing,

but it can be misapplied, certainly.

Ian has watched as Pete Buttigieg struggles to explain his relationship with the firm.

That's what employees call McKinsey on the inside.

Simply, the firm.

He's really moved from, you know, sort of neutral or maybe a little bit positive stance

to reacting quite forcefully to some of the more recent stories.

He said something along the lines of McKinsey is as amoral as any company in the business

world, which is, you know, true, but it's a striking thing for him to say.

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