When leadership advice feels like buzzwords and platitudes, it's time to get real.

HPR's podcast Coaching Real Leaders brings you behind closed doors as Muriel Wilkins coaches anonymous

leaders through raw honest career questions

that we all face.

Listen and follow coaching real leaders for free

wherever you get your podcasts. Hello and

with me in the studio today are Boris Kreisberg and Michael Slend.

They're authors of the new book Talk Inc.

how trusted leaders use conversation to power their

organizations. Gentlemen, thanks for joining us today.

Great to be here. Thanks for having us Julia. Well, congratulations on the book.

It's directed, obviously, leaders of large organizations.

It reflects a lot of wisdom from corporate communications executives, but it's really about employee engagement,

isn't it?

So the book actually, I mean, focuses on employee engagement and the reason why we focus on

employee engagement is kind of a basically the higher on employee's

basically the higher the engagement of your employees

the barrier performance is going to be.

You know, I think we started this project, you know, about four years ago ago and what this book is all about is about an

organization that is full of conversation.

If you think about what organization is all about, it's just basically a bunch of conversations that happening at the same time.

And what leaders do to facilitate the conversations that actually produce value, right,

...