My name is Stan. I'm at. Nice to meet you. So you took up photography where? I've always loved

photography but I turn it into earning a living at 60. I enrolled on a day course.

Well college. I loved going to college. It's good you can retry. I'm enrolled on the day course. But college?

I loved going to college.

It's good you can retrain and do something.

Yeah, yeah.

Let's talk about working, learning, saving and making the most of living longer.

Phoenix Group is the UK's largest long-term savings and retirement business.

Search Phoenix Group living longer. Hello and welcome to the bunker daily. I am your host Aleksandro. I don't believe it's possible for any detainee to receive a fair

trial in China. China has no rule of law. Arbitrary justice is not justice at all.

Those are the words of my guest today, an external research affiliate of Harvard University

who has spent almost 50 years focused on China and lived there for half of that time. He worked for Reuters

as a correspondence before founding a firm that offered fraud investigation services

to international business. He ended up spending two years in the Chinese

prison system after what is seen by most as a case of selective prosecution.

He now spends his time campaigning for the release of other prisoners in China and raising awareness of the dangers for Western companies that operate there.

Welcome to the bunker Peter Humphrey.

Thank you.

Peter, the details of why you and your wife were arrested are in a

strange way both complex and very very simple. The simple version I would say is that you compiled a report for a client

that basically landed you in the middle of a much bigger fight involving people high up

in the Communist Party who then targeted you. Is that a fair if crude summary of the sort of background?

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