How Big Money Changed The Democratic Game, with Daniel Ziblatt

Capitalisn't

University of Chicago Podcast Network

Stigler Center, Chicago Booth, Socialism, Antitrust, University Of Chicago Podcast Network, Growth, 087667, Policy, Monopoly, Professors, Distortion, Research, Competition, Capitalisnt, Inequality, Promarket, Politics, Policymaking, Special Interest, Economics, Efficiency, Regulations, Chicago, Business, Markets, University Of Chicago, Kate Waldock, Capitalism, Friction, Bethany Mclean, Government, Macroeconomics, News, Education, Waldock, Georgetown, Microeconomics, Luigi Zingales, Zingales, Finance, Ucpn

4.5 • 584 Ratings

🗓️ 2 January 2025

⏱️ 50 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

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Summary

Daniel Ziblatt is an American political scientist, Eaton Professor of the Science of Government at Harvard University, and the co-author (with Steven Levitsky) of several bestselling books, including How Democracies Die and Tyranny of the Minority. Ziblatt writes from the position that what defines strong democracies is free and fair competition for power, inclusive participation, and a package of civil liberties that make those first two conditions possible. 2024 saw voters in more than 60 countries go to the polls—and deliver difficult outcomes for incumbents and traditional political parties. This week, Ziblatt joins Bethany and Luigi to discuss the fate of democracy after 2024. They explore how big money and corporate power have destabilized democracies worldwide by interfering with the conditions for free and fair competition for power. The consequence has been the movement of voters toward political extremes, which in turn can often threaten economic growth, civil liberties, and the rule of law. Nevertheless, should we judge the strength of democracy by process or outcome? Does democracy still thrive when the people vote for undemocratic politicians and parties? Together, Ziblatt and our co-hosts discuss how to curb global democratic decline by realigning government away from the interests of corporations or big money and back to those of the people.

Transcript

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0:00.0	big money is a problem because it distorts our politics.
0:03.5	You know, so let's say consider like the minimum wage, you know, there's overwhelming
0:06.5	majorities of Americans in favor of a higher national minimum wage.
0:10.8	This stuff gets blocked and it creates legitimacy crises for a democracy because more
0:15.5	and more citizens feel that government's out of touch.
0:17.8	Then you're attracted to outsiders who in some cases may be good,
0:21.6	but in other cases may be demagogic.
0:25.8	I'm Bethany McLean.
0:27.5	Did you ever have a moment of doubt about capitalism and whether greed's a good idea?
0:32.7	And I'm Luigi Zengalis.
0:33.8	We have socialism for the very rich, rugged individualism for the poor.
0:39.6	And this is Capital Isn't, a podcast about what is working in capitalism.
0:43.5	First of all, tell me, is there some society you know that doesn't run on greed?
0:48.0	And most importantly, what isn't?
0:50.0	We ought to do better by the people that get left behind. I don't think we shouldn't kill
0:54.0	the capital system in the process.
0:56.5	We at Capitalism are very interested in the interaction between capitalism and democracy.
1:02.0	Democracy is essential for setting the rules of the game, and you need the right rules of the game to create a flourishing capitalist system.
1:08.6	But then in turn, capitalism can both help and hinder democracy.
1:12.2	If it helps create economic freedom and freedom of speech, then it helps democracy.
1:16.7	If capitalism is tilting toward corruption, both of ideas and of money, then it hurts democracy.
1:22.4	If I'm allowed an infomercial, this year the annual Steger antitrust conference,
	...

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