That's how we should be arranged in the economy, not around things that make money, but around things that are essential to our survival. Hello and welcome to Tech Won't Save Us, a podcast that wonders how Elon Musk can get away with everything he gets away with and never face any consequences.

I'm your host, Paris Marks, and today I'm speaking with Lizzie O'Shea.

Lizzie is the author of future histories why Ada Lovelace, Tom Payne, and the Paris Commune

can teach us about digital technology. She's also the founder and chair of Digital Rights Watch

and has written for a number of publications, including The New York Times, The Guardian,

and the Sydney Morning

Herald. Before I get into today's episode and we start the interview, I just want to say that

this is the eighth episode of Tech Won't Save Us. It's four weeks of the podcast, and it's been

fantastic to see the response and that a lot of people are liking it.

Thank you so much if you're a listener and if you've been listening since the beginning or,

you know, whenever you started and if you like it, thank you.

If you want to support the podcast because you like it, there are a few ways that you can do that.

Firstly, you can go to Apple Podcasts and leave a

five-star review so more people can find it and, you know, see that it's something that other

people are liking. So far, we have five-star reviews in Australia, in Canada, in Germany,

in New Zealand, in Sweden, in the United Kingdom, and in the United States. And obviously, I would love

to see those in even more countries. So if you can leave one, that would be great. And finally,

it takes a lot of time to put this podcast together. So if you want to support me and the work

that I'm doing on this podcast, my other writing, you know, what have you? Your support on

Patreon would be greatly appreciated, and that's at

patreon.com slash Paris Marks. There should be a link in the show notes, and if not, you can find it

on our Twitter, which is at Tech Won't Save Us, or you can find it on our website, which is

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