I'm Hugh Rifkin, and now we're going to be unpacking the politics of the day,

and today we're going to be asking why people think immigration is much higher than it really is,

how to handle a political heckler, and whether Elon Musk is really about to become the world's first trillionaire.

And joining me today, they're not trillionaires, but they are rich in insights and opinion, that's far more valuable in my eyes. They are Fraser Nelson. Hello Fraser. Good to have you with us and Cindy. Hello, Cindy. Morning. Fraser and Nelson, Fraser and Nelson, Fraser and Cindy, both from the times. How are you both keeping, Cindy? How are you? I'm well, thank you. How are you, Hugo? Yeah, I'm good. Fraser, what's your news? What's the tea?

Of the tea? I'm heading to Sweden tomorrow. I'm getting quite excited about it. Very nice. You've got family in Sweden, of course. I do, exactly. My son's about to start university there, so we're going to just settle them down. Is it horrendously wholesome? And it's is what I know Look I love as Sweden is my sort of

Second favourite settle them down. Is it horrendously wholesome? It's, I don't know, look, I love, as Sweden is my sort of second favourite small country in the world

after Scotland. And it's, look, it is incredible, it's underrated, it's got a great entrepreneur

culture who's going to business school there, which should be great. And I guess it's like a sort of you know when your kids leave school

it's it's sort of a ride of passages you know so I'm giving it kind of you know sunrise sunset in my

head you know they're thinking about the achievements it's made so it's a it's a you know great time

in your life this is going to sound like a weird question but can can you rollerblade? No, I can't.

Why?

They can't teach me.

The one time I went to Stockholm, no, I've been twice, but the first time I went to Stockholm, everyone was rollerblading. And I said, why is everyone here so good at rollerblading? And I was told because we all ice skate during the winter on the rivers for the islands. Yeah, well, they do. And they practice during the summer to keep their muscles up during the winter.

Right.

But it's not rollerblade, it's a skate replica.

Right. They do, and they practice during the summer to keep their muscles up during the winter. But it's not rollerblade, it's a skate replica. It's something quite important. They swim. There's a whole lifestyle change. It's a great place. I'm going to assume that's just what you do to go out and get a loaf of bread in the morning. Cindy, I'm going to assume you can rollerblade beautifully. Don't ruin the magic. Sorry, go on.

No, no, I actually did figure skating as a child.

Well, there we go. You're virtually Swedish.

Let's start with, we should probably talk about some news. Let's start with the new official

migration figures published this morning. Net migration in 2025 was down almost 50% on

the year before. It now stands at 171,000. That's the lowest

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