Because we're down here in Wake Forest, we're going to have an unusually long interview today.

I just wanted to take this chance with Rosaria and her husband Kent to think a little bit more carefully about her book.

Hi, I'm Jonathan Lehman, and welcome to this episode of Nine Marks Pastors Talk.

Nine Marks exist to equip church leaders with biblical vision and practical resources for building healthy churches.

Learn more at nine marks.org.

Mark Dehr was unable to join us today, in part because I'm in Durham, North Carolina,

in the home of Kent and Rosaria Butterfield.

Kent is the pastor of First Reformed Presbyterian Church in Durham, here in Durham, and his wife,

Rosaria, is the author of several books, including most recently, The Gospel comes with a house

key, practicing radically ordinary hospitality in our post-Christian world.

Thank you both for taking the time.

You're welcome.

It's our pleasure.

Thank you.

Kent, you recently wrote an article for nine marks on elders and hospitality, and you

make the observation that as you guys are sitting down and interviewing

future elders or pastoral candidates you'll often ask about their hospitality and guys often

will simply emphasize oh my wife does a really good job at this and you're like okay that's fine

but what about you and you say it's problematic if they don't understand that themselves.

Why is that problematic?

Well, it's, you know, the requirements in 1 Timothy 3 and Titus 1 is referencing the elder,

the man in regards to his qualifications.

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