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The Holy Post

Episode 489: The Evangelical Empire Strikes Back & Barna Briefs with David Kinnaman

The Holy Post

Phil Vischer

Skyejethani, Society & Culture, Philvischer, Religion & Spirituality, Christianity, 226012, Christiantaylor, Atheism, Veggietales

4.64.1K Ratings

🗓️ 29 December 2021

⏱️ 88 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

After the mess that was 2020, we had such high hopes for 2021. Were our expectations met? Phil and Skye look back on the year when the evangelical empire dug in its heels. Those opposed to #MeToo and Black Lives Matter responded by labeling empathy a sin. Voices advocating for women and people of color within the SBC left the denomination. The Salvation Army reversed course on racial sensitivity, and female scholars faced a backlash for exposing Christian nationalism and patriarchy. Will 2022 be any different, or will the sorting of the entire culture into Red and Blue tribes continue? And how wide will the rift between classical and cultural evangelicals get?

Then, the president of Barna Group, David Kinnaman, joins Skye to launch a new reoccurring segment—Barna Briefs. Kinnaman reveals brand new data about the state of the church and how the pandemic has revealed wide discontent among churchgoers with their congregations. He also says popular church structures are clearly insufficient for forming mature disciples and new church models are desperately needed. Kinnaman also reveals an alarming number of pastors are ready to leave ministry. Is there a silver lining to all of the troubling data?

News Segment:

0:00 - Intro

4:34 - Looking back and looking ahead
https://www.holypost.com/post/438-the-year-that-unveiled-evangelicalism-with-john-fea

9:10 - Stories from 2021: The “sin of empathy” conversation
Holy Post episode 472 - https://youtu.be/D_NHhmdss5w?t=2000

12:28 - Was 2021 “The Empire Strikes Back”?

15:47 - Russell Moore and the ERLC
Painting Phil references - https://www.metrotimes.com/the-scene/archives/2021/12/12/detroit-artist-jonathan-harris-strikes-a-nerve-around-the-world-with-critical-race-theory-painting26:02 - Salvation Army and “wokeness”

32:18 - Books from this year
“Jesus and John Wayne” by Kristin Kobes Du Mez - https://amzn.to/3mHdVMx
“The Making of Biblical Womanhood” by Beth Allison Barr - https://amzn.to/3ECopmL

42:01 - The Rise and Fall of Mars Hill podcast
https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/podcasts/rise-and-fall-of-mars-hill/
“Church Refugees” by Josh Packard - https://amzn.to/3pzky5m
“A Church Called Tov ” by Scot McKnight and Laura Barringer - https://amzn.to/3z4DJr7

53:06 - Looking toward 2022

Movie Phil references - “Don’t Look Up” (2021)

Barna Brief with David Kinnaman:

Free download for Holy Post listeners: https://www.barna.com/holypost/

1:02:37 - Interview Start
1:04:12 - Project intro: State of the Church
https://www.barna.com/stateofthechurch/

1:05:31 - Digital church and effects of the pandemic
1:17:06 - Growing crisis among pastors
1:22:53 - Mental and emotional impact of pandemic

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Transcript

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0:00.0

Welcome to The Holy Post. This week, Phil and I do a retrospective on 2021, which Phil

0:06.0

dubs the year the Empire struck back. We recall some of the biggest stories and trends, and

0:11.5

then we pontificate about what to expect in 2022. Then I'm joined by my friend David

0:16.8

Kinnaman, the president of the Barna Group, to launch a new reoccurring segment on the

0:21.2

podcast that we're calling Barna Briefs. Kinnaman reveals brand new research about the

0:26.2

state of the church and alarming numbers about pastoral burnout. But before we start today, just a

0:32.2

quick word of deep appreciation to all of you for making 2021 the biggest year of the Holy

0:37.4

Post ever. Thank you for your support via Patreon and for sharing the show on social media and with

0:43.2

your friends. We have some big plans for next year, which is our 10th anniversary. So stay tuned for

0:48.3

some exciting announcements in the weeks ahead. Okay, here's episode 489. Hey, they're welcome back

0:54.2

to the Holy Post podcast. This is Phil Vissier. I am here with Skyjutani. Hi Sky. Hi, Phil. And

1:02.7

that's it. Sky. All the real serious kids showed up and everyone else is just on holiday. It's just

1:10.8

it's as we're recording, it's the two days after Christmas, Monday, the 27th of December. So we're

1:18.1

in that week between Christmas in New Year's where all sane people have stopped working and gone to

1:24.6

other places. And yet here I am and here Sky is for you guys to make, to give you content.

1:33.8

Because we know that your thirst for content is nigh unto insatiable. And so here we are.

1:41.5

Here we are. I have to do two podcasts today. That's how committed I am. You are you are

1:47.0

Uber committed. What are you recording later today? French Friday. French Friday, which I think

1:52.5

will release on New Year's Eve. Oh, that's Friday. Okay. So is it going to be alcohol themed?

1:59.0

New Year's Eve? No, I don't know David's alcohol preferences point of view. Point of view.

2:04.8

Yeah. Or is it Omicron themed for not having any New Year's Eve fun? Yeah, that could be it.

2:11.3

It's really been a downer this year. It really has been. I was texting you with it earlier. I'm

...

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