Hello, I'm Adrienne Dob.

And I'm Moira Donigan.

Whether we like it or not, we're doing the natural law episode finally.

Oh my God, Adrian, this one has been literally years in the making.

You kept kicking it down the road because it seemed like such a monster project.

Yeah. And we finally said, no, it's time. And we bit the bullet. And here we are today talking

about Thomas Aquinas and natural law and this weird intellectual legacy and its influence on our

gender politics now. That's right. Just as a fun little factoid, as I was searching for the

document with all our notes, I realized we teased this in our very first episode. Did we seriously?

Yes, it's on the list that I think I read at the end of that episode of like ideas we had for

future episodes. Like this is the kind of thing you might get on this podcast.

Well, here we are pretty much exactly, what, three years later? Three years. If you've been waiting for this since 2023, listeners. Our apologies, we owe you. Your patience has finally been

rewarded. You deserve sainthood. Like St. Thomas, you deserve sainthood just for waiting all this time.

Yeah, but as more as suggesting, this is one of those things that was more easily said than done, because it is huge.

And I do think that on this podcast, we try to take these traditions seriously while disagreeing with them.

And that's one thing when you're doing a social phenomenon. It's like 40 years old. It's another,

if it's like, it goes back to the pre-Socratics, basically, which is also to say, like, please don't

use this in lieu of an actual kind of, there are books

called Introduction to Natural Law Theory and that kind of stuff. If it's really important to you,

please pick those up. This cannot substitute for that. It's just like unbelievable how much there is

to read. And I don't think I've like fully scratched the surface in researching this.

I love it when like at the beginning of our podcast, Adrian the erudite, very meticulous,

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