Hello, I'm Adrienne Dobb.

And I'm Moira Donagin.

And whether we like it or not, we're in bed with the right.

So, Adrian, today we are talking about somebody who's really under my skin, who I think I could talk about forever.

And now it's going to be your problem and our listeners' problem, because today we are talking about a little lady named Elizabeth Katie Stanton.

Phenomenal. This is one of the white whales that we've talked about for a long time.

I am ready, I trust you, I'm going to make a Seneca trust fall.

Yeah, and, no, I've had her on the brain for a couple of years.

She's kind of the object of some controversy, and I had a chance recently to write a review of a new Stanton biography for the New Yorker.

Shout out to my editor there, Morella Gaia, who was absolutely great.

And some of the ideas I'm going to be sharing with you here are actually hers.

It's like a kind of like nice little secret of having a good editor.

Is it as the writer you get to take their good ideas and just pass them off as your

own. But she has been sort of on my mind for a while as both a paradigmatic figure in her own

right, somebody who's really influential in the history of early American feminism. One of the

inventors of what I would say is like the liberal feminist intellectual tradition that comes

out of the Enlightenment, and also somebody who is the object of a lot, a lot, a lot of discourse

and hand-ringing and controversy, and we're going to get into it all today.

Yeah, so she's kind of an unusual subject for us

because we don't tend to associate her with gender conservatism.

But, of course, I think you're partaking of a really kind of unique

and laudable feature of feminist thought,

...