Patri is all about maintaining a very specific line of ideology and

both of you are engaged in this work in such a few power and so coming and both of you are engaged in this work in such a beautiful way where you're giving space for women to share their unique voices and experiences.

That is, like collectively that is the dissolution of patriarchy. Welcome to at last she said it. I'm Cynthia Wynward and I'm just going to do a

quick intro before our mini episode with Catherine Knight Sondag. Often when we

record with guests there's just so much good stuff to talk about, so we often

save little bits and pieces for bonus episodes.

This conversation is just had. Enjoy.

In episode 30, Catherine, which was the first conversation that we had.

You said something that I have never stopped thinking about

and it was this, Keeping women silent, keeping women separate,

keeping women degraded is a very real tool of the adversary to continue to rule on

this earth. There's no happenstance to the way things are and the way

women have been siloed from having a larger voice. Seeing women pedestalized and silenced

is the sign in my mind that Babylon rains. And this raised for me, actually I think

you were explicit about it, but for the first time I had ever thought about it the idea of patriarchy as sin.

Can you talk to us a little bit more about that? Yeah I I began to do a lot of work around the creation story for this book and really wanted to sink into my own sort of visionary state about, you know, what is this story?

What is it for me deeply in my heart?

What truths can sort of rise up in this space that feel like a true

expression of God as I know God because God, while God has changed in some ways for me as I've grown and learned and progressed,

there's a core essence to who God is that feels like my own core essence that has always remained present.

And looking at the creation story, trying to access that space as I wrote about it really made the story alive for me in a way that I can't.

It's very hard to describe, but I really felt in this practice the idea that the struggle between the the power

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