meta_pixel
Tapesearch Logo
Log in
The Deconstructionists

Ep. 236 - Lillian Daniel "Defrocked: Good News from a Bad Pastor for a Better Church" pt. 1

The Deconstructionists

John Williamson

Religion, Religion & Spirituality

4.4823 Ratings

🗓️ 9 April 2026

⏱️ 33 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

📝 Episode Summary

Drawing from her new book, Defrocked: Good News from a Bad Pastor for a Better Church, Lillian shares her journey through ministry, the unexpected challenges she encountered, and the moments that forced her to rethink long-held assumptions about leadership, faith, and belonging.


This episode is an honest look at what happens when certainty begins to crack—and why that might not be the end of faith, but the beginning of something more real.

📚 About the Book


Defrocked: Good News from a Bad Pastor for a Better Church

A candid and often humorous reflection on ministry, failure, and the possibility of a more honest and compassionate church. Lillian Daniel offers a rare behind-the-scenes look at pastoral life—challenging assumptions while pointing toward a healthier future.


👤 About the Guest

Lillian Daniel is a United Church of Christ minister, author, and speaker known for her wit, honesty, and thoughtful critique of modern church culture. Her work often explores faith, doubt, leadership, and the evolving role of the church in contemporary life.


🔗 Resources & Links

• Find Lillian’s book wherever books are sold

• Learn more about her work and writing: www.lilliandaniel.com

🎙️ Support the Show


If you enjoyed this episode, you can support The Deconstructionists Podcast by:

• Joining our Patreon for ad-free episodes, bonus content, and educational videos: https://www.patreon.com/cw/TheDeconstructionistsPodcast

• Checking out our merch store (ships worldwide): https://thedeconstructionists.printify.me/

• Leaving a rating & review—it really helps others find the show



Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

I think we were all taught, well, okay, I was taught the Good Samaritan story all wrong, which was the moral of the story is, you should be a Good Samaritan. Great, I want to be the Good Samaritan. And of course we want to be the Good Samaritan. In the story, he's a cool guy. He has money. He has points at the inn. He can drop the person off and pay for it. He's culturally sensitive. He knows that they're enemies. It's like, yeah, I want to do that.

0:24.4

And I'm thinking, and drop the person off and pay for it. He's culturally sensitive. He knows that they're enemies.

0:22.6

It's like, yeah, I want to do that.

0:24.6

And I think in specifically Western culture, we're all like,

0:27.6

yeah, let me earn this much money and become a partner in a law firm,

0:31.6

and then I'll be a really good Samaritan.

0:33.6

But it's a power position.

0:35.6

And we always assume that the choices for us are the two power roles.

0:40.2

We're either the helper or the person who walks by and is busy going to the meeting, the priests, the other in the story.

0:47.0

Because we don't want to think about being in the ditch.

0:54.0

So take a breath, breathing in the mystery that...

1:02.7

Welcome to the Deconstructionist podcast.

1:04.5

I am your host, John Williamson, and we are back with a brand new episode,

1:08.6

but with a returning guest that I'm very excited about.

1:11.3

We had a great conversation as always.

1:13.1

But before I get to that, there are a couple ways to support the podcast if you would like to,

1:18.7

if you have the means to do so.

1:21.2

Number one, we have a brand new Patreon that we launched that has new incentives on there.

1:29.7

And one that I've been having a lot of fun with. So a lot of these topics that we launched that has new incentives on there and one that I've been having a lot of fun with.

1:35.2

So a lot of these topics that we've been doing deep dive episodes on, I do an even deeper dive on the Patreon.

1:37.2

And along with it, you also get some materials.

1:40.1

And so I've created some content there that you can use if you have a small group,

...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from John Williamson, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of John Williamson and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.

Copyright © Tapesearch 2026.