Welcome to the global phenomenon, Surviving the Survivor, where we bring you the best guests in all of true crime.

Here's your host, Emmy Award winning journalist Joel Waldman.

What's up, SCS Nation?

Welcome to another episode of Surviving the Survivor.

It is the podcast that promises to bring you the very best guests in all of true crime.

And today is a day that we should not be having,

but it was 14 years ago on this very day that Ellen Greenberg,

Ellen Greenberg, who was then an elementary school teacher,

living in Philadelphia with her fiance,

was found dead under what many believe are suspicious circumstances.

It was January 26, 2011. Today it is January 6, 26, 2025. You do the math,

14 years, and about $7,000 to $800,000 later out of their own money, Josh and Sandy are inching closer, I think, to getting answers.

And I've read a whole bunch of stories leading into this evening.

And many people feel that 2025 will be the year where we finally get some answers

in the pursuit of justice for Ellen Greenberg.

But of course, we are joined by her parents, Josh and Sandy and Gavin Fish, who was investigative

journalist by day and an investigative journalist by night on his own YouTube channel,

Gavin Fish. And he has been following this case incredibly

closely, as have journalists at the Philadelphia Enquirer, Penn Live, and many other places,

and it is starting to finally, I feel like, get momentum. But Sandy, to you, obviously a very bittersweet day.

I mean, it's nice that people are focused on this, I think,

and that it appears a lot more big-name journalists have gotten on board

...