From KCRW Santa Monica and KCRW.com, it's The Treatment.

It's the Treatment.

I'm Elvis Mitchell.

You can also hear this show at KCRW.com.

What is it that makes a star?

Well, I think it's the kind of person who, when you're talking to them, you feel like they're the only person they're talking to.

In the case of my guest, restaurateur, bon vivant, and very healthy human being, Judy Perrin.

He is all those things.

The introduction to his book alone does that thing that you want a memoir to do, which is to say it makes you feel like you're listening to the conversation. And not only that it has the same flow, the same conversational catences that talking to him does, the book is called I'm Not Trying to Be Difficult. Story from the Restaurant Trenches. I'm so happy to be talking to you, Drew. I'm so thrilled. Thank you so much for doing this,

first of all. Thanks, Elvis. Good to be with you today. This must be the only book about a

restaurateur that has both Muhammad Ali and Joe Frazier in it. Well, I'll tell you what. I'll

tell you what. You know, like as a kid, Ali, you know, he was, I mean, he was a hero to a lot of people,

but for me, it was, just to hear him talk, he was so articulate. And he was always fighting,

you know, because he, I mean, he's a boxer, but he was fighting everybody, you know, the government.

If you look back on his life, it was, it is

magical. So I kind of like, you know, he was a major inspiration. And Joe Frazier, totally different

kind of cat, but when I opened Harley Davidson Cafe, this is a hundred years ago, today they show

pictures of Trump with Epstein at this, at the opening

of Harley Davidson. And they used to show O.J. and his wife, who obviously, he was at the

opening of Harley Davidson, but reading Joe Frazier at the Harley Davidson and then, what do you

call, Nelson Mandela.

Well, that's what I'm going to say, because the book starts off, your introduction,

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