Welcome to Hard Talk on the BBC World Service with me, Zainabidawi in Nairobi.

My guest is one of Kenya's groundbreaking cultural figures, Njoki Ngumi.

She abandoned her career as a medical doctor to set up an arts collective, believing that

creative endeavours can play a vital role in transforming societies.

But one of the collective's films exploring homosexuality was banned.

Gay sex is a crime in Kenya.

So how far is she shifting opinions?

Dr. Unjoki Ngumi in Nairobi, welcome to Hard Talk.

Thank you so much for having me, Zainab. It's lovely to be here.

You studied medicine at Nairobi University. You worked as a doctor for three years,

and then you gave up practicing medicine. Why?

I really dislike the term give up. I feel like I kind of opened the hospital doors

and went out into the world where a lot of other things are waiting, including patients at times when they're not necessarily having to come and perform.

Being a patient in the hospital, people are sick everywhere and doctors can be useful everywhere, not just in a hospital.

But look, people are sick everywhere. Yeah. And you know how the Kenyan Health Service has taken a real hammering during

the pandemic. Two of your friends died from COVID. And the country needs doctors. Let me give

you a figure. There are 26 doctors for every 100,000 people in Kenya. The European Union average

is 336 per 100,000. Your country needs you to work as a

doctor. I don't think my country can force me to work as a doctor. And I think there's a large

number of doctors who are currently being forced to work as doctors because they probably

didn't work on finding something else that they wanted to do

or that they feel kind of trapped. And when I talk to my colleagues, because we're all in one

...