Hey friend, welcome to the Mere Christians podcast. I'm Jordan Raynor.

How does the gospel influence the work of mere Christians? Those of us who aren't pastors

or religious professionals, but who work as teachers, plumbers, and programmers.

That's the question we explore every week.

And today, I'm posing it to a living legend, Dr. Francis Collins,

former director of the National Institutes for Health.

Before that, the leader of the human genome project.

And man, when history looks back at the scientific achievements of the 20th century,

I think they're going to point to splitting the atom, going to the moon,

and sequencing the human genome, the project led by today's legendary guest.

Dr. Collins and I recently sat down to discuss the lesson he learned from getting punked by Borat, aka Sasha Barrett Cohen. We talked about the four

criteria Dr. Collins uses to discern who to trust at work and in life. And finally, Dr.

Collins shared what Tim Keller's out-of-office message said, the day that he died,

trust me, you are not going to want to miss this terrific conversation with Dr. Francis Collins.

Dr. Collins, welcome back to the Mere Christian's podcast.

Glad to be with you again, Jordan.

I had a good time the last time, and hopefully this will be like that too.

I was joking with a friend the other day.

I said it took 18 months to get Dr. Collins the first time, you know, when he was trying to save the world from a global pandemic.

It took like 18 hours the second time. So got a little bit more time on your hands.

Hey, I told you before we start recording, this new book, The Road to Wisdom, was exceptional.

Easily one of the best books I've read this year so far. You immediately drew me in with your humility on the very first page you opened up about this

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