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Downstream: Has Israel Become A Fascist State? w/ Ilan Pappé

Novara Media

Novara Media

Philosophy, News, Politics, Society & Culture

4.81.4K Ratings

🗓️ 21 April 2025

⏱️ 74 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Aaron Bastani was joined by Israeli historian Ilan Pappé for a live recording of Downstream on 7 April at EartH in East London. They discussed the origins of Britain’s Israel lobby, the indoctrination of Israelis, and whether the recent atrocities committed in Gaza and the West Bank are signs of Israel’s imminent collapse. Help us […]

Transcript

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0:00.0

Anna Holland was a pretty normal teenager.

0:04.0

Shy, well-behaved.

0:06.0

I was a real goodie, two shoes.

0:08.0

You know, my homework is always in our time.

0:10.0

No one would have predicted that a couple of years after leaving school,

0:14.0

Anna would be in prison for throwing soup at a priceless painting.

0:18.0

Oh my God. What is worth more?

0:22.6

Art or life?

0:25.6

Just a few months before their now infamous soup-throwing action, Anna had signed up to just stop oil.

0:31.6

The group's activists are some of the most hated people in Britain.

0:35.6

The anti-growth coalition that we have to thank for the disruption that we are seeing on our roads today.

0:45.3

And it's not just tabloid readers and Tory ministers that don't get them.

0:49.3

I also really care about the climate crisis, and I struggle to understand why Justop Oil's activists put

0:56.1

themselves up for such punishment. Is any cause really worth your freedom? My going to prison

1:02.3

was completely my choice. I think the irresponsible thing would have been for me to not do anything,

1:07.8

and just to hope that someone else would fix it for me.

1:15.7

I'm Rivka Brown and I'm Claire Heimer and we've been trying to figure out how someone could go from a high school goodie two shoes to a convicted criminal.

1:19.4

On committed, we go behind bars to find out what life's like for Britain's climate activists,

1:25.4

whether their relationships can survive the separation,

1:28.5

and why Anna doesn't regret a minute they spent in prison?

1:32.2

I toasted the judge she sentenced me,

1:35.1

thanking him for that time in prison,

...

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