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The Oath and The Office

DOJ vs. Trump: The Indictment That Never Came (with Glenn Kirschner)

The Oath and The Office

Corey Brettschneider

Government, News, Politics

4.9 • 591 Ratings

🗓️ 22 January 2026

⏱️ 71 minutes

🔗️ Recording | iTunes | RSS

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

The indictment that never came is still shaping DOJ’s ongoing battle with Trump.

In the first half, Corey Brettschneider and John Fugelsang break down this week’s accountability flashpoints:
  • The push to impeach DHS Secretary Kristi Noem — what impeaching a cabinet official actually means and why it matters now
  • The Supreme Court fight tied to the FTC with huge stakes for independent agencies and the question of whether a president can threaten the Federal Reserve
  • The looming tariff decision — and how tariffs are being used as political leverage, including in Trump’s pressure campaign involving Greenland
Then Corey and John are joined by Glenn Kirschner (former federal prosecutor) for a blunt, inside-the-system conversation about:
  • What went wrong with Robert Mueller
  • The decision not to indict Trump — and the precedent it set
  • How DOJ “corruption” happens in real life: pressure, incentives, normalization
  • The hardest moral call for public servants: stay and fight, or resign and warn the country
If the law won’t check power, what will?

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Welcome to The Oath and the Office.

0:12.3

I'm John Fuglesang, joined as always by the star of this show.

0:16.4

Ivy League, political science professor, author of The Oath and the Office and the Presidents and the people,

0:39.8

and a man kicked out of Wu-Tang Clan for being too hardcore. I give you Professor Corey Brett Schneider. Corey, hello, hello from L.A. where I'm taping today. Yes, I know you're out there, and thanks for that intro. They get better and more ridiculous every week, so I look forward to that. And, you know, we have an amazing show today.

0:43.9

Of course, we're going to talk about how to fight back using impeachment. We're going to talk about the Federal Reserve case that the Supreme Court's going to hear. And then we have this

0:48.1

amazing guest. And Glenn Kirshner is going to talk to us about the attack from the DOJ,

0:55.9

the weaponization of the DOJ,

1:00.3

as an insider, somebody who worked there for a long time. So a great show today.

1:05.5

Terrific. And there's so much to get to. Hey, by the way, congratulations. No more fentany boats making its way to America. I mean, we've saved what? Like, like thousands and thousands of

1:10.2

lives because there's no more drugs coming anymore. That's what Venezuela was all about, right? I understand. Now they're just talking about oil and that Trump's going to take the money from the oil and put it into an account over it. But it was about the defendant. I mean, the cocaine, not the fentany. I'm not sure they kept changing the stories. And Greenland, you should get very use of the stories being changed.

1:27.8

So it's been a crazy week, Professor.

1:30.4

The DOJ is launching this insane prosecution of the Fed chair because he won't lower interest rates.

1:36.5

They're still trying to fire Lisa Cook.

1:38.4

Trump is threatening to send troops to arrest protesters in Minneapolis after Renee Good was killed by an immigration officer, and they are

1:45.0

still covering that up, not allowing state law enforcement to investigate anything. Trump now says

1:52.2

he will take a Greenland, whether Denmark likes it or not, and he's sending bizarre letters to the

1:57.4

leaders of Norway, indicating he doesn't know how things work. He's threatening war with Iran, declaring himself acting president of Venezuela.

2:04.6

The DOJ just searched the home of a Washington Post reporter, and Jeff Bezos has decided

2:08.6

it's not worth commenting on.

2:10.6

And a federal judge this week compared Trump to an authoritarian on free speech, saying that

2:15.6

he seeks to exclude from participation everyone who doesn't agree with them.

2:19.3

This was a Ronald Reagan appointee, and the White House has accused him of being a left-wing activist.

...

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