Doctors' Notes: All-or-Nothing Thinking
What's Up Docs?
BBC
4.4 • 659 Ratings
🗓️ 11 November 2025
⏱️ 20 minutes
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Summary
Drs Chris and Xand continue their conversation about all-or-nothing thinking with Kimberley Wilson, Chartered Psychologist, author and host of the new mental health podcast, Complex.
Chris and Xand want to know how all-or-nothing thinking interacts with out socio-politics, and how age and our relationship with social media shapes our tendency towards binary thought patterns.
If you’d like to share your thoughts on this or any other topic covered on the podcast, you email us at whatsupdocs@bbc.co.uk or Whatsapp on 08000 665 123.
Presenters: Drs Chris and Xand van Tulleken Guest: Kimberley Wilson Producer: Maia Miller-Lewis Executive Producer: Rami Tzabar Editor: Jo Rowntree Researcher: Kimberley Wilson Tech Lead: Reuben Huxtable Social Media: Leon Gower Digital Lead: Richard Berry Composer: Phoebe McFarlane Sound Design: Ruth Rainey
At the BBC: Assistant Commissioner: Greg Smith Commissioning Editor: Rhian Roberts
A Loftus Media production for BBC Radio 4.
Transcript
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| 0:00.0 | BBC Sounds |
| 0:02.2 | Music Radio Podcasts |
| 0:04.6 | I like when a manager wears a suit and tides, you know what I mean? |
| 0:09.7 | In 2025, we were here for the football. |
| 0:13.0 | The Wayne Rooney Show |
| 0:14.0 | As a manager, you're making decisions on what you're seeing on the pitch. |
| 0:16.9 | Sometimes it doesn't always pay off. |
| 0:18.3 | Football daily. |
| 0:19.4 | Loyalty in football. Does it still exist? There football daily loyalty in football does it still exist |
| 0:21.8 | there is no loyalty in football and tunie and russo do you feel like the pressure actually helps |
| 0:26.9 | you play the best football we've prepared ourselves to step out onto the pitch at the end of the day |
| 0:31.2 | get the best of 2025 with podcasts on BBC Sounds. |
| 0:40.5 | Hello and welcome to Doctor's Notes. |
| 0:41.9 | I'm Dr. Zan-Fantilicon, |
| 0:45.0 | and as ever I'm here with my identical twin brother. |
| 0:46.5 | Dr. Chris Van Tiliken, |
| 0:49.5 | and we've just finished recording an interview with Kimberly Wilson. |
| 0:55.0 | We were talking about binary, black and white, all or nothing thinking. |
| 1:00.2 | It's fair to say I went on a bit of a journey in the main episode. |
| 1:05.4 | I started the episode thinking not just that it was important, but that it was inevitable. |
| 1:06.8 | And that it was good? |
| 1:14.3 | I finished the main app with not only the understanding that it needn't be inevitable and it was quite harmful, but also with some tools to stop doing it. So that was handy. As always, |
... |
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