Today, we're getting into a feeling that I'm sure my fellow reality TV heads have felt.

You're watching your favorite reality junk TV. Could be selling sunset, could be the Kardashians,

or even the housewives of your nearest big city. You look at what they have, high ceilings,

waxed and buffed floors, marble countertops, crown molding, fine art on the

walls. And then you look at what you have, a white refrigerator and a kind of nice coffee table

from Facebook Marketplace. I'm talking about where our producer Corey Antonio calls housing dysphoria,

the dissatisfaction with your own living

space that comes from comparing yourself to the lifestyles of the rich and famous, particularly on

reality TV. And hide every fancy farmhouse, beige mansion, or mid-century modern luxury home,

is a dream that's being sold to audiences across the world. But why exactly are we buying it? To find out,

I'm here with Jack Balderrama Morley, the author of Dream Fasades, the cruel architecture of reality TV.

Hello. And Liam Dillon, staff writer at Politico who covers housing issues. Hi. I am so happy to

have you both. Let's get into it. Hello, hello. I'm

Brittany Luce and you're listening to It's Been a Minute from NPR, a show about what's going on in culture

and why it doesn't happen by accident. Even if I would never trade places with certain reality TV stars like Yolanda

Foster, Miss, I'm going to cook for my man, my man, my man, my man.

I would want to trade places with Yolanda Foster, but I would love to trade houses with her.

I mean, I'd love to trade houses with a few of the girls from Real Housewives.

And I think it's the same for many viewers.

What is it about the homes on these shows that keep us coming back?

I mean, the homes on these shows are just very nice.

I think that's a big part of it, right?

...