Hello and welcome to Happy Place with me, Fern Cotton.

This is the show that believes everyone has the right to feel able to show up in the

world as their authentic self.

Today I'm chatting to Kelly Holmes.

It was really difficult for me to try and explain some things when people go, oh yeah but

everyone no one cares anymore.

But are I care?

You know, no one cares because the society is changing and we're in a better world where

people here will go, it shouldn't be spoken about.

It's awesome, that's so lovely to hear and we want that to be the case.

But unfortunately for lots of reasons, a lot of people win their lives, have to care or

do care because it isn't so easy for them to make that next step.

Kelly was first on the podcast back in 2019 but a lot has changed for her since then.

Just a couple of weeks ago she came out publicly as gay.

As you'll hear in this gorgeous conversation I had with her at my house recently, it's

a truth she's been acknowledging privately for decades but was never able to discuss openly

for numerous heartbreaking, maddening reasons.

Kelly served in the military at a time when homosexuality was banned in the British army,

Royal Navy and RAF.

It was only in the year 2000 after she'd left that the law changed.

By that time she was a celebrated athlete, not only could she not see many other gay

sports people around her but there was a real fear that coming out would by default

...