Office building is trading at 20 to 25 cents in a dollar replacement cost.

More square footage being demolished or converted than built for the first time in decades,

and yet the headlines still say that office is dead.

And if that's true, somebody's about to make a lot of money off being wrong.

I'm Kevin Bup, and this is the Real Estate Investing for Cashflow podcast.

This show is all about uncovering real-world cash flow

strategies, and today's office conversation is a reminder that typically the best opportunities

often live where the headlines preach doom and gloom. In this show, we're going to be unpacking

why office might be the buy of the decade despite ugly headlines. We're going to talk about how to

use replacement costs, supply destruction, and submarket data

to separate great opportunities from future write-offs,

and then what underwriting guardrails and debt terms

actually make sense for office in this real estate cycle.

Now, to walk us through it,

I'm joined here today by Michael Bull,

a 35-year commercial real estate veteran.

Michael has spent more than 35 years in commercial

real estate. He's completed more than $8 billion of transactions. He leads Bull Realty's National

Office Group, and since 2010, he's been the host of America's commercial real estate show.

And so today, it's going to be an exciting one. We're going to dive into a topic that Michael has been, you know, shouting from the mountaintop about as of lately. And that is why Office may be the buy of the decade. And so Michael, welcome to the show, my friend. It's a pleasure to have you here. Well, thank you, Kevin. And if you're starting out with the how I love Office, most of your listeners are going to say, What, Office? This guy's crazy. Well, you know, it is, it's funny. But everyone, everyone is aware of the adage of, of, you know, going against the herd or buying when there's blood in the streets, right? But when, when the blood's actually flowing, everyone doesn't know what the hell to do, right? Everyone's like, ah, you know, everyone gets scared and has trepidation. So I'm excited to unpack this with you here today. You know, it's interesting. I was just talking a little bit before we got rolling here that, you know, while we're predominantly parking and manufacture housing investors, I mean, that's our, that's our MO. We bought an office building. It was kind of take all or take nothing back in Phoenix about, about two and a half years ago, and it's been an amazing investment. You know, bought it probably at what we could have called the bottom of the Phoenix marketplace and bought it for well below replacement costs at an incredibly low basis, and it has, you know, worked wonders for us in our portfolio. So we're not office guys,

but we happen to own some office. And so again, excited to have this conversation here today.

So I've read a number of articles where you have said that, you know, office might be the buy

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