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Divided Argument

Counter-Counter-Counter-Designations

Divided Argument

Will Baude & Dan Epps

Politics, Government, Justice, Legal, Supreme Court, News, Law

4.8766 Ratings

🗓️ 20 November 2025

⏱️ 55 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Will and Dan record a rare live show in an unusual venue: the Salamander Resort in Middleburg, Virginia, at the annual attorney retreat for trial boutique Wilkinson Stekloff. Dan teaches Will some of the new lingo he's learned from the firm's trial experts before a deep dive into civil procedure. First, we dig into the recently argued Coney Island Auto Parts Unlimited v. Burton, which presents a seemingly easy legal question and harder questions about SCOTUS advocacy and ethics. Then we look back at last Term's LabCorp v. Davis, which the Court DIG'd but which raises some fundamental questions about class action litigation that the Court is likely to revisit down the road.

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Oh, yay, oh, yay, oh, yay, oh, yay.

0:03.4

The judicial power of the United States shall be vested in one Supreme Court.

0:08.1

Unless there is any more question to be able to find an argument in this case.

0:10.9

All persons having business before the Honorable, the Supreme Court of the United States, are admonished to give their attention.

0:20.0

Welcome to Divided Argument, an unscheduled, unpredictable Supreme Court podcast.

0:24.1

I'm Dan Apps.

0:25.0

And I'm Will Bowdo.

0:26.0

So, Will, we are doing one of our rare live appearances.

0:29.8

We only get to do two or three of these a year.

0:32.3

This one is a little bit of a change of pace.

0:34.2

Because we are live from the Salamander five-star resort and spa in Middleburg, Virginia,

0:40.3

not our normal venue. And why we're here, I think requires a little bit of a detour.

0:45.4

So when I'm not doing one of the eight million other things I'm doing, such as talking to you,

0:51.4

I am of-counsel at the law firm Wilkinson-Steclough. And for those listeners who don't know, Wilkinson-Stekloff, is a boutique firm with offices in D.C. and New York, that I think fairly can be described as the best trial boutique in the country. Folks, do we say best trial firm in the country, or just trial boutique? Okay, and everyone's just sort of looking at me.

1:11.6

This is a, okay, I thought I was going to get like a kind of, you know, rip-roaring response to that

1:16.8

one. So a bunch of great trial lawyers. And for my part, I use chat GBT to make pictures of

1:22.8

Supreme Court justices as Muppets. So there have been a lot of kind of synergies between what I can offer.

1:28.9

Seriously, there's some great people here, and it's fun to pretend that I actually have kind of

1:33.4

real practical skills, and I'm not just pursuing constitutional theory all the time.

1:38.0

But Will, you practice law a bit, right?

1:40.8

A bit. So as you know, Dan, I am still not a member of the Supreme Court Bar, but luckily,

1:45.5

one of my best friends is, actually, while I am here, we are finalizing a Supreme Court

...

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