Welcome back to the podcast, bribe, swindle, or steel.

I'm Alexandra Rogge.

Today we have a great discussion on the corruption by Fat Leonard of the U.S. 7th Fleet.

Our speakers are Doyle Hodges, a retired U.S. naval commander, and now executive editor of the Texas National Security Review, and Stephen Rogge, Professor at the U.S. Naval Academy in Annapolis.

We both have taught at the Naval Academy at times. We're both much involved in the Navy. I've been at the Naval Academy in Annapolis for quite a long time, and for those who aren't part of the American educational system, what it is is like a university,

but all the graduates become military officers. The Army has one at West Point. The Navy has one

at Annapolis. We're from the Annapolis one. But Doyle's done more than that. He's commanded

ships in the Pacific and also in the Atlantic, the Med, and in the Middle East.

And like a lot of people who commanded ships in the Pacific, he had a run in with Fat Leonard.

More on that later.

Now, our job here is to make a long and very rich story short.

So we'll leave out all the good stuff, but over drinks right after, all right?

Here's the story.

The two of us have taught at the academy, we both taught courses on ethics.

What happened here?

And I'll try to describe it, but first, about Fat Leonard.

Over a span of two decades, the man they call Fat Leonard engineered and

operated a system of bribery that thoroughly, deeply corrupted. About 30 officers in the Pacific,

32 have pled guilty already, but also he compromised about 500 more. And we're not talking just about lieutenants. Admirals, for example,

five dozen admirals, 60 admirals have been compromised enough to have to be investigated by

the Naval Criminal Investigative Service. And ones in prison, seven have had administrative actions that terminated their careers.

So officers at all levels.

...