The Art of Leadership Network.

What also happened that didn't make the headline so much

was the power abuse that was kind of uncovered.

And that actually, you know, hundreds if not thousands of people felt that.

And so it's not, it wasn't a bigger problem, especially for those women that were impacted,

but it was a problem nonetheless. And there was this this culture of power abuse like I'll just give you one example.

Excellence has always been a really high core value for Willow Creek and I actually believe

excellence is a good value. Excellence honors God and inspires people was the phrase that we

used but that value had been turned into or redefined as perfection.

Welcome to the Carrie Newhoff leadership podcast. It's Cary here and I hope our time together today helps you thrive in life and leadership.

That is the goal of this podcast.

And that's why we are bringing you Tim Stevens today.

You know what, there's a lot that's tough in the world of church,

but there's also a lot of good in the world of church.

And if you've been following what's happened at Willow Creek over the last decade, Yeah, I mean it was absolutely devastating and

there's also new life. So I sit down with Tim Stevens and we talk about the

dynamics of abuse at Willow Creek. I know this is sensitive conversation. I hope you'll appreciate

the nuance in it, the problem of isolated leaders, leading when you start with zero trust and

building a new culture and finding momentum as you reach the next generation.

I hope it's truly going to be helpful.

I know a lot of people listen to this podcast.

Some of you were involved at Willow Creek, some of you may have been on staff, and so hopefully this helps

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