Classic: Intelligent Design on Trial – 15 Years After Kitzmiller-Dover - Mike Behe v Joshua Swamidass

Unbelievable?

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Christianity, Religion & Spirituality

4.6 • 2.3K Ratings

🗓️ 8 April 2025

⏱️ 68 minutes

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Summary

As we prepare a fresh episode exploring the legacy of Intelligent Design, we’re diving back into the archives to revisit this compelling 2020 conversation between biochemist Michael Behe and biologist Joshua Swamidass. In 2005, the high-profile Kitzmiller v. Dover trial challenged the Dover School District’s attempt to introduce Intelligent Design (ID) as an alternative to evolution in the classroom. Behe, a leading advocate for ID and a key witness in the trial, reflects on the case and its impact on the movement 15 years later. Swamidass, a fellow Christian and critic of ID, engages Behe on the scientific and theological implications of the trial and offers a robust critique of Behe’s book Darwin Devolves. A fascinating and respectful face-off on science, faith, and the question of design in nature. 📌 Stay Connected & Join the Conversation 📍 Twitter (X):@UnbelievableFE 📍 Facebook:@PremierUnbelievable 📍 Instagram:@Premier.Unbelievable 📍 TikTok:@PremierUnbelievable For Michael Behe: https://michaelbehe.com/ For Joshua Swamidass: https://peacefulscience.org/

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0:46.5	Well, hello and welcome to another edition of Unbelievable with me, Justin Briley,
0:50.1	the show that brings you conversations that matter here on Premier Christian Radio,
0:53.2	broadcasting all over the world via podcast and video,
0:55.2	and really excited about today's discussion, which takes us back to a famous trial 15 years ago centering on intelligent design.
1:02.0	The Dover School District in Pennsylvania was taken to court by parents contesting a policy
1:06.9	that required students to be made aware that Darwinian evolution was a disputed theory and allowed
1:12.4	students access to alternative resources on intelligent design. While the Dover School Board
1:17.5	ultimately lost the trial as the judge ruled against the presentation of ID as a scientific
1:22.6	alternative to Darwinian theory. Many hailed it as a victory for science. Many decried it as a pointless exercise.
1:29.5	Ideas like these can't be settled in a court of law. Well, I'm joined on the show today by biologist
1:34.4	Michael Behe, who's a well-known advocate of intelligent design and was a key witness for the
1:39.7	defence in the Dover trial in 2005. Mike's most recent book, Darwin Devolves, explains why he believes
1:46.1	the evidence against Darwinian evolution has only increased in the past 15 years. Opposite Michael
1:52.6	today is another biologist Joshua Swarmidas, author of the genealogical Adam and Eve. Joshua
1:58.4	is a Christian who believes in the harmony of science and faith, but is
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