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Hello and welcome to Chinese Whispers with me, Cindy Yu.

Every episode, I'll be talking to journalists, experts, and long-time China watchers about the latest in Chinese politics, society and more.

There'll be a smattering of history to catch you up on the background knowledge

and some context as well. How did the Chinese see these issues?

Last week, President Joe Biden finally signed into law a bill that would take TikTok off app stores in the US,

eventually rendering the app obsolete there.

Now, this is not the end of the story, as TikTok has vowed to take legal action against the bill.

But nevertheless, it is the latest development in the American decoupling from Chinese technology.

In this episode, we'll be taking a look at the reverse trend, that is, the Chinese decoupling

from American technology. It's a story that tends to go under the radar in light of bans and

divestments from the US, but you might be surprised at how much China is cutting out American

tech too, and doing it much more quietly. I'm joined by the journalist Lisa Lin, who has

been following this story in her detailed

coverage for the Wall Street Journal. She's also a co-author of the book Surveillance State,

Inside China's quest to launch a new era of social control. Lisa, welcome to Chinese Whispers.

Now can we start with Document 79, which you recently wrote about? It's quite blandly named,

but interesting in content. Thanks, Cindy. Thanks for having me. So Document 79 is this mysterious directive that has

come from the Chinese regulator of the state-owned enterprises in the country. And this directive,

...