Ted Audio Collective. I believe in rethinking ideas we've taken for granted to learn how to live better.

In my new podcast, Rethinking, I ask today's greatest minds, how they think, and what assumptions

we should all reconsider. Listen to rethinking wherever you get your

podcasts. Hey listener, a quick favor. We are conducting an audience survey and

we'd be really grateful if you could take just a few minutes to respond.

Please visit survey.

PRX.org slash design matters to take the survey today.

That's survey dot PRX.org

slash design matters. Thanks. And you know it's funny as I say these words

the female in me the woman who is raised as a girl is like, oh, don't say that.

Don't say you want to be a great American writer.

This is Design Matters with Debbie Millman.

On this episode, Debbie talks with writer Cheryl Strait about her childhood, her career,

and about the value of taking a very long hike.

What happens on the outside, one foot in front of the other, in front of the other, also happens on the inside.

The way to heal anything is to keep going.

Here's Debbie first with a word from our sponsor, then with her interview with Cheryl Strad.

Design Matters is supported in part by Heflare and Co. online at typography.com.

There's nothing more critical to good design than good typography, and good typography begins with the best possible ingredients, the fonts themselves.

Peflar and Co are the designers of some of the world's most beloved typefaces,

classics like Gotham and Knockout,

and new designs like operator and decimal,

...