From the Centre for European Reform, this is the CERR podcast.

Hello and welcome to another episode of the CER podcast. My name is Beth Oppenheim and I'm a researcher at the Centre for European Reform.

I'm here today with Sophia Besh, who is your usual host and a research fellow here at the

CER. Hi, Sophia. Hi, this is great. And today we're going to be discussing your new policy brief,

which is about defence after Brexit. So the UK is a major defence power in the EU, and some are

optimistic enough to believe that security and foreign policy will be quite a promising

area of the negotiations because it's there that the power is somewhat more balanced, unlike in the trade domain,

which is probably why things are becoming so acrimonious.

What do you think?

Do you think it's British arrogance to think that the EU needs the UK in this field?

Or do you think that this is one area

where the UK actually has quite a strong contribution to make? And in that case, do you think

that without British involvement, EU defence institutions could well see themselves becoming

defunct or lacking in credibility if the EU doesn't find a way to draw the UK in after Brexit?

That's a great question, a great set of questions really.

So I think you're absolutely right that this is one of the few areas where there is actually a positive sum game to be achieved here.

Both sides have an interest in close cooperation. The EU does have an interest in keeping the UK

involved in its missions and operations. When British politicians say that the UK delivers a huge

part of European security, they're absolutely right. Despite the fact that in previous years,

Britain has contributed limited numbers of personnel to CSDP missions, so to the EU's defense

missions, it does remain one of the few

EU member states that is capable of providing military assets that can fulfill really special functions

...