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The Welcome to another episode of Conversations with Coleman.

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Welcome to another episode of Conversations with Coleman. My guest today is David Bernstein.

David is a professor at George Mason University Law School and the executive director of their

Liberty and Law Center.

His new book is called Classified, The Untold Story of Racial Classification in America.

Topics covered in this episode include the definition of race, the historical origins of

America's Big Five racial and ethnic categories,

which are Asian American, Black, Hispanic, American Indian, and White. We discuss the problems

with all of these categories and how those problems manifest in race-based affirmative action

programs and race-based social spending in general.

We discussed the phenomenon of racial fraud trials where judges have to determine the race of individuals seeking to qualify for certain programs. We discussed the malleability of racial

identity and how commonly our racial identities can change in response to incentives.

And finally, we discussed the prospect of what David calls a separation of race and state. I really enjoy this conversation,

and I hope you do too. So without further ado, David Bernstein. All right, David Bernstein. Thanks so much for coming on my show.

Thanks so much for having me, cool.

So we're going to get into your excellent new book, which I really enjoyed reading so much.

And congratulations on it. It's called Classified, the untold story of racial classification in America.

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