One thing about FTX that's like really particular is that it's apparently very uncommon for most of the like creditor claims to be individual people who were customers of a company.

FTX was just like hundreds of thousands of people.

You know, instead of getting their assets returned in like in the form that they were holding them, they were getting them back in dollar values.

And in FTX's case, this was pegged to like the time of the bankruptcy filing, which was when obviously the market was at its lowest point. So it's like parts of the company, it's cryptocurrency assets, it's venture assets, like all of these pieces. And then the other category is actually just fees. And not just Sullivan and Cromwell, but other professional firms that are involved in the bankruptcy. Because like when we talk about the almost $1 billion figure, it's not, that's not all going to Sullivan and Cromwell. I think

they're the like big name that's, that's become associated with high fees. But like, there are a lot of different firms that are involved. There's a conflicts council. There's, um, investigatory firms. There's all kinds of stuff. Bankruptcy can't just be right. It has to seem right. And I think this is really

a case where it didn't seem right. And so, you know, if you're somebody who's waiting to get your

money back, it's bankruptcy can't just be right. It has to seem right. And I think this is really a case where

like it didn't seem right. And so, you know, if you're somebody who's waiting to get your money back, it's, and it's the bankruptcy team is saying, we don't think you're going to get your money back because this company is such a mess. And then you're looking at these fee statements. You can understand why somebody really starts to say something is really wrong here. Welcome back to Bickman season two.

You remember the SBF, FTX,

crash and fallout story,

but that is not really where it ends. The bankruptcy

proceedings are ongoing and it turns out maybe way more interesting than you realize. There

is definitely a part two to the story. I have two folks who worked on investigating the bankruptcy process on the show

today and I'll read a quote from one of their pieces. Quote, all told, the cost of bankruptcy

is expected to exceed $1 billion. For some, it turns out bankruptcy can be astonishingly profitable.

We're going to dig into this. Welcome back. Let's kick it off.

Jonathan, Sophie, welcome to the show. Who are you guys? What do you do? Sophie, you want to start with?

You start first? Sure.

My name is Sophie.

I'm a writer and an audio producer.

And I'm really excited to have been working with Jonathan on this very convoluted story.

Yeah.

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