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I'm David Brown and this is Business Wars.

Like the rum that fills their oak barrels, the battle between liquor giants Bacardi and Pernot Recart has aged for years.

The bitter dispute over the rightful owner of the Havana Club trademark has spanned generations.

Yet for the families that produce this traditional Cuban rum and the loyal fans who drink it, this war is about more than just a trademark.

It's a fight grounded in Cuban identity, culture and politics, and it's far from over.

But before we can ask the real Havana Club to stand up, we've got to wade through a murky pool of legal grey areas, government alliances and fickle geopolitical policies.

Guiding us through all this is our guest today, Lillian Guerra, a Cuban American author, historian and professor at the University of Florida, and the director of their Cuba program.

We'll be talking about where the spirit's battle stands from, a Cuban perspective, exploring the island's economics and the future of Havana Club on the American stage. All that's coming up next.

Lillian Guerra, welcome to Business Wars.

Thank you for inviting me.

This is a deeply personal rivalry that seems like it's never going to end. What's the current situation between Bacardi and Pernod Ricard?

Well, I don't know that it has changed in any way. The Cuban government is very committed to working with its partners at Pernod Ricard.

As far as I know that Biden administration has not taken any steps to back the lawsuit that Bacardi has filed. So we're still at a standstill there.

Yeah, I was curious about how much the Cuban people themselves know about this rivalry. Do you have a sense that every day Cubans' persons on the street are aware of this battle?

I'm certain that they are completely unaware. I do think they have very strong opinions about rum, and in particular Havana Club as they have experienced it on the island.

But they know anything about this really would be impossible. The Cuban government has very little transparency with regard to its own budget and its own income or the state's expenditures. So something like this will not make headlines.

Unless it's politically expedient. So if they are to win their battle, then I assume it will be all splashed all over the national newspaper. But until then nothing.

So for our listeners and perhaps others who are joining us fresh, in one corner you have Pernod claiming Havana Club must be made in Cuba. Then in the other corner there's Bacardi who says they can make it in Puerto Rico since they have the recipe history and Cuban family identity on their side.

We're talking about the founders in this case. In your mind, who has the real stuff?

I think it's very interesting to say that my knowledge of Cuban rum and Bacardi produced it comes from the island. And in Cuba when Havana Club started becoming a regular item on display and dollar stores, stores that sold in dollars to foreigners and in hotels, Cubans were convinced that it was not being made properly because they weren't using the old barrels that are still out in Oriente.

It's just the far eastern province and they were using metal barrels and distillery that was relatively recently acquired in two modern. So there was no way that what was being replicated there in Cuba would resemble the real stuff.

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