I mean I think there's an interesting I'm curious to get back maybe to the historical trajectory where it's like so you have the 70s and there's this fragmentation that happens of the 60s youth cultural movement as maybe it becomes consumerist or as you know the war ends etc and these various things sort of happen but then by the 80s you have this kind of yuppification of,

you know, the 60s kind of era.

And you have people like Jerry Rubin or Stewart Brand or others like making a lot of money and kind of thinking that like the

Jerry Rubin was as the as a $3 bill.

Like, I'll give you an example.

One time we had a riot on the street on Lower East Side. It was a Saturday night so Sunday morning you

could get the Sunday times. So here comes Jerry Rubin and Abbey Hopin got their Sunday Times and they all of a sudden passed this

riot on the street. Jerry Rubin took his New York Times and ran home. Abby Hoffman joined

the riot.

Right. But I mean... That'll tell you something right there about happy Hopin.

And then he became a stockbroker.

Right, that's what I'm kind of trying to think about or get at.

So in the 60s, you have this kind of peer pressure,

social pressure, that people should participate

in some kind of subversive countercultural movement but by the 80s that same peer pressure

is now funneling you into like a financial success or something and...

No, you're funneling yourself into it.

You're allowing yourself to be sucked into it.

So you could be comfortable and you could receive remuneration.

Do you think that was just with people's age,

you know, as this kind of youth movement got older?

Or was it political or psychological what what

...