Hi, I'm Ben Miller, a writer, researcher, and member of the board of the Gay Museum in Berlin.

And I'm Hugh Lemmy, a writer and author.

And this is the second episode of Season 2 of Badgays, a podcast about evil and complicated

gay man in history.

We ask, why don't we spend as much time thinking about our villains as we do our heroes?

And what makes a villain anyway? Is it someone that we think is terrible,

or someone who's been unfairly tarnished by history? Last week, we talked about a Grecian conqueror

who rode across the world of his boyfriend? Who are we talking about this week, Ben?

Today we're going to explore the short and bloody life of Andrew Cunanin, a black hole of gay

narcissism. Black holes are attractors. We risk being sucked in. Andrew Cunanan, a black hole of gay narcissism. Black holes are attractors. We risk being

sucked in. Andrew Cunanan answers the following question. What happens when evil twink energy

flames out? When the transition to bitter old queen, a role that requires a bit of money

or some social position, doesn't work? What happens to those people? Anyone who's ever been

to a gay bar has met one of these delusional queens, the ones who have a rotating series of

sugar daddies, a new name every few months, a new fake job, like they're auditioning for the role

of the kind of men who run their lives. Most of them may get to some point of social position, and the

cycle of gay life continues. But some of them start pushing 30 and realize that nothing is coming

their way. Everything's beginning to fall apart, to spin out of control. Even those ones, most of them,

find somewhere to land. Not Andrew Kinanan. Andrew Kinanan is the dark heart of evil

twink energy consuming itself, and evil twink energy can't consume itself without consuming

a few others too. Andrew Kinan killed Jeffrey Trail, David Madsen, Lee Miglin, William

Reese, and in South Beach, a guy named Johnny Versace. He's always just remembered as the guy who killed Versace, though, because the case became

...