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The Lawfare Podcast

Alexander Downes on the Foreshadowed Failures of Foreign-Imposed Regime Change

The Lawfare Podcast

The Lawfare Institute

International Law, Law, Government, Foreign Policy, News, Politics, Rule Of Law, International Relations, Current Events, Military, Constitutional Law, Intelligence, National Security, History, Terrorism, Diplomacy

4.76.4K Ratings

🗓️ 12 October 2022

⏱️ 54 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Foreign-imposed regime change is a policy tool that a number of countries—most frequently the United States—have used to establish friendly regimes and align interests in regions around the world. With the ongoing unrest in Iran and the war in Ukraine, foreign-imposed regime change is in the news once again.

But conversations around foreign-imposed regime change often occur without reference to the whole historical record. Hindsight might suggest that foreign-imposed regime change can be done but that it just needs to be done better, that we just need more resources or better strategy. 

To evaluate the efficacy of foreign-imposed regime change in a systematic way, Lawfare associate editor Hyemin Han spoke with Alexander Downes, professor of political science and international affairs at The George Washington University, who wrote a book about it called “Catastrophic Success: Why Foreign-Imposed Regime Change Goes Wrong.” With his data set, he draws out the lessons we can learn from attempts of foreign-imposed regime change over time. Ultimately, he argues that even when foreign-imposed regime change works, its successes don't last very long, and the downsides of regime change are actually built into the process of trying to achieve it in the first place.

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Transcript

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0:00.0

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0:07.2

podcast become a material supporter of LawFair at patreon.com slash LawFair.

0:14.7

That's patreon.com slash LawFair.

0:18.2

Also, check out LawFair's other podcast offerings, rational security, chatter, LawFair

0:25.6

no bull and the aftermath.

0:31.2

Right laptop, I'm ready to finish this thesis.

0:34.2

What thesis?

0:35.2

The one I've spent two years working on.

0:36.7

Don't have it.

0:37.7

What's the last version you saved?

0:39.4

Got final version, final final version, and no, I'm actually serious now.

0:42.9

This is the last version I will never save another version I promise, version two.

0:46.7

Surely that one?

0:47.7

No.

0:48.7

Why?

0:49.7

It's corrupted.

0:50.7

Oh, thanks.

1:01.5

Saved it again.

1:08.6

The costs are very high and you know, lots of things are built in there.

1:13.3

Not just the immediate costs of the invasion, the costs of reconstruction, of the occupation,

1:20.0

the then of sense the insurgency happened afterwards, all the human costs to US soldiers,

1:27.2

the long term medical care that they need for PTSD and for other injuries.

...

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