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The Bulwark Podcast

Alex Wagner: Team Trump Can't Get Its Epstein Story Straight

The Bulwark Podcast

The Bulwark

Politics, News, News Commentary

4.68.9K Ratings

🗓️ 13 November 2025

⏱️ 58 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

Trump's involvement with Epstein is simultaneously a "hoax," but he was also a "perfect gentleman" when he spent hours with one of Epstein's underage victims, Virgina Giuffre, at Epstein's pad. And Trump was an FBI informant on Epstein's sex trafficking, but again, it's all a hoax. The White House and Fox's defense is not working, and Trump may be in the worst political shape he's been in since the aftermath of January 6. Meanwhile, the wealthy and powerful old men needing teenage girls raises huge questions about manhood and virility. Plus, the shutdown fight was a stress test for how far the Dems were willing to go in the face of an authoritarian, and the party's big tent strategy faces real headwinds.

Alex Wagner joins Tim Miller.

show notes

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Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

Hello and welcome to the Bullwark podcast. I'm your host, Tim Miller,

0:15.7

delighted to welcome to the show, the host of the new podcast, Runaway Country from Crooked Media.

0:20.5

I know those guys. She also writes on Substack, How the Hell with Alex Wagner. It's Alex Wagner. Welcome back, girl. How you doing? You know, no one says runaway country like you. You just, there's a certain southern lilt that I really appreciate. I too. And it's just, I still love this country. You know, I still got my Georgeia in me. Yeah, you got it in you. You know, I still got it. I might not be a Republican anymore, but I still love this country. You have that conservative enunciation and I'm here for it, Tim. I am here for it. That is good. I'm glad that you can notice. I'm glad that you can notice. I do occasionally the progressive listeners. Some of my word choice, it's just different. I'm just, I'm not, I'm still an immigrant to the coalition. And we want you to retain. Sometimes I say a word and I didn't realize that this is a sensitive word now or what we're not saying. It's a salad bowl, not a melting pot. You are who you are, and we appreciate you for who you are.

1:12.3

I'm the peppers.

1:13.1

You're the cherry tomato.

1:15.2

Oh, I love a cherry tomato. Okay, let's talk about Jeffrey Epstein. Yeah, good segue. The pedophile. I don't know who he is in the salad bowl, the balsamic. We talked about this a little bit yesterday, but it was breaking right as Michael Phanone came on.

1:27.9

So I think it's worth just kind of revisiting.

1:30.6

I want to talk about the trumpet. we talked about this a little bit yesterday, but it was breaking right as Michael Phenone came on.

1:27.9

So I think it's worth just kind of revisiting. I want to talk about the Trump of it first. There's so much, though. When we were on, it was just kind of those three Trump emails that had been leaked. And then there are like 20,000 pages that were leaked after that. I'm not going to pretend like I read all of them. But I read a lot. and, you know, we have some bulwark nerds who are combing for me.

1:46.7

And so we'll get to some of that.

1:47.8

We appreciate those bulwark nerds. Yeah, we do. And also reporters who are doing some impressive. We do appreciate the reporters and the nerds both. The key ones, though, remain. He was spending hours alone. Yesterday, we were talking about this. the victims ain't been redacted, but it was Virginia

2:01.6

Geoffrey.

2:02.8

And we saw in an unredacted email.

2:05.5

He'd spent hours alone with her at Trump's home.

2:08.9

It's important who she is for some of the reasons of the Trump spin, which we'll get to

2:12.1

in a second.

2:12.9

There's also the Maxwell Epstein email about how Trump knew about the girls with regards to the ones

2:20.3

that he'd taken from Marlago.

2:22.8

One that we hadn't got to yesterday, Epstein emailed Obama lawyer Catherine Rumler.

2:28.0

I'm still not sure why she and Epstein were such pals.

2:31.1

Kathy Rumler had a lot of correspondence. The White House counsel.

2:34.7

Yeah.

...

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