Hello and welcome to the Bullock podcast.

I'm your host Tim Miller.

Glad to welcome back to the show,

staff writer at The Atlantic and the author of The Cruelty is the Point.

It's Adam Sarwar. How you doing, man?

I'm all right. How are you doing, Tim?

I'm doing maybe a little better than you. You kind of seem sad. You're just all right.

You got allergies. You know, I think devoting rights acting is one of the most depressing and

demoralizing developments in American politics. I think, you know, watching things

like Tennessee redistrict, its only black district out of existence, you know, days

essentially after the ruling, you know, it's very hard to think about all the people who live through, you know, the 1960s

and the civil rights movement who are now seeing all that work, all that sacrifice, being

undone by a court that is equal parts naive and malicious.

All right.

Well, let's get into that.

I was thinking about this before I had John. You can kind of see, get a sense for what's going wrong in the country based on guest frequency. It's like it's not really a great sign for no racial and social justice issues that this is my second Adam Sarwar visit in the last couple months. But I do. I appreciate you coming on. Your latest article on

this kind of goes back. I want to spend a lot of time on Tennessee, but I do think it's

valuable to take the lens back a little bit. And you started talking about a character that

only old-timers maybe or conservative media obsessives would know about a guy named James Jackson

Kilpatrick. And why don't you just kind of talk about why you framed up the article about

the decision around him and, you know, what lessons we can learn from that?

Well, Copacritic's an interesting figure because, you know, he starts off as a hardcore segregationist as a guy who is opposed

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