From the New York Times, I'm Michael Bavaro. This is The Daily.

Today, the Supreme Court begins hearing arguments about whether the Trump administration acted

legally when it tried to shut down DACA. Julie Davis, on why the outcome of the case,

may turn on a small act of rebellion by one of the president's own eights.

It's Tuesday, November 12.

Julie Davis, how exactly did DACA become the subject of a Supreme Court case?

Well, since President Trump was a candidate,

I will immediately terminate President Obama's illegal executive order on immigration.

Immediately.

He campaigned basically saying that DACA, which was this program that Barack Obama created in 2012,

for undocumented people who had been brought to the United States as children, was illegal.

He defied federal law and the Constitution to give amnesty to approximately five million

illegal immigrants, five million.

He was going to get rid of it, which of course would mean that they would be vulnerable to deportation.

That's over. That's over folks. That's over.

So he came into office saying he was going to do this, but actually very quickly started talking

very differently about the program. I want to ask about undocumented immigrants who are here

in this country right now that are protected as so-called dreamers. Should they be worried?

They shouldn't be very worried. They are here illegally. They shouldn't be very worried. I do have

a big heart. We're going to take care of everybody. And so he was already kind of making noises like

maybe he didn't mean what he said on the campaign trail. DACA is a very, very difficult subject for me.

I will tell you. To me, it's one of the most difficult subjects I have. And then he kept on talking

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