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Marketing School - Digital Marketing and Online Marketing Tips

A Moat Is Not A Noun. It's A Verb.

Marketing School - Digital Marketing and Online Marketing Tips

Eric Siu and Neil Patel

Careers, Business, Marketing

4.6 β€’ 1.3K Ratings

πŸ—“οΈ 15 October 2025

⏱️ 20 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

In this episode, Neil and Eric unpack how speed, brand, and switching costs form modern startup moats in an era where insights depreciate fast. Drawing from Garry Tan’s β€œmoat is a verb” concept and real-world case studies, they explain how execution speed compounds advantage, why AI shifts moat dynamics, and how founders can turn speed into durable defensibility through process power, brand, and network effects. Key takeaways β€’ Speed is a moat when insights fade fast β€’ Brand and switching costs still compound β€’ Execution speed amplifies defensibility TIMESTAMPS (00:00) Moats explained and Buffett context (01:50) Depreciating insights in AI (04:55) Brand moat debate and switching costs (07:20) Microsoft Teams case study (16:56) Global expansion lessons and wrap 𝗔𝗕𝗒𝗨𝗧 π—§π—›π—˜ π—–π—›π—”π—‘π—‘π—˜π—Ÿ Welcome to Marketing School, one of the top business podcasts with over 61 million downloads. Each episode delivers actionable marketing tips and strategies from two entrepreneurs who truly practice what they preach. The show is hosted by Eric Siu, founder of Leveling Up and Single Grain, and Neil Patel, co-founder of Neil Patel Digital and recognized by Forbes as a Top 10 Marketer. LEARN MORE ABOUT THE HOSTS Eric Siu – Leveling Up: https://www.youtube.com/@LevelingUpOfficial Neil Patel: https://www.youtube.com/@neilpatel FREE RESOURCES Growth Newsletter: https://levelingup.beehiiv.com/subscribe Ubersuggest: https://www.ubersuggest.com/ Answer The Public: https://www.answerthepublic.com/

Transcript

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0:00.0

So people like to talk about moats, right?

0:01.6

Do you want to say something?

0:02.7

No.

0:03.0

Okay.

0:03.9

So people like to talk about moats.

0:05.7

And moats are defensibility, like Warren Buffett used to like to talk about moats. Like when you have a castle, you want moats protecting it. So it's not as a, you know, it's more defensible, right? And so. Do you want to describe it and how it will be in the castle? Yeah. Okay, so like you have a water moat around the castle.

0:21.3

So like you have the drawbridge that's up.

0:23.0

You can't just, you know a water moat around the castle.

0:21.3

So like you have the drawbridge that's up. You can't just, you know, you can't just attack the castle and scale it, right? So this is back in the day. Now, now today, founders, businesses, they like to talk about moats, you know. Or if you're trying to raise investment, people are like, oh, like what moat do you have? Like, how is this defensible?

0:37.1

How come, you know, opening?

0:38.3

I can't just kill you, right?

0:39.7

But people have described a moat as what, a noun, but a moat actually, Neil, is a verb. And so Gary Tan said this from YC. It's a verb. So popular beliefs that startups win because they have one big game changing insight. But the WinServe CEO argues that's a myth. Every single

0:56.6

insight that we have is a depreciating insight. Okay. So if I tell you this new idea what Chacheebee,

1:01.3

it's already depreciating right now. In other words, the value of your insight declines fast.

1:05.5

Competitors catch up, market shift. What was once novel becomes table stakes. So yesterday's amazing was today's average, right? NVIDE as an example, even at trillion dollar scale on 70% gross margins, they still have to innovate or AMD catches up, right? The real advantage is continuously generating new insights and executing on them. So it's not about the insight you had one year ago. It's whether you can compound that advantage over and over again. And so a moat is not a noun. It's a verb. So you have to move very quickly. And that speed is actually a moat now. Like people will say, oh, switching costs, that's a moat. Branding is a moat. Um, your processing power like Toyota, for example, that's a moat but But speed, something that you've always had, speed is a moat, right? And it's hard, though, because the AI, everything moves so much faster. It doesn't, like, okay, even though, let's say I read more than you or whatever, you're still, your speed is really quick. You have a different way of learning. You're calling people all the time. You're still pushing ideas through. And so we have different ways of pushing through our speed. And remember the AI called me out? It's like, yeah, you're F1 driver and you just need to build a system that's like a like F1 car. What did it say? It's a F1 driver in a car. Your F1 driver in a Honda Civic right now. I was like, oh, good good cars though. Good cars. Motherfucker. So part of my

2:18.8

language. But I shared it with my team too, and we're laughing about it because it's like the

2:22.7

system will scale, right, over time. And earlier, it goes back to how much capacity does your

2:28.3

system have, does your team have, right? And so for you right now, like, sure, you might have a

2:33.5

bunch of ideas,

2:34.8

but that is, that is the moat ultimately. Because if you start to slow down, if you start to say, I'm going to get out of these people's way, I'm going to let them do their thing, you think they're going to move as quickly as you are? You think they're going to have the same urgency you're going to have. So if you had a pick, okay, what do you think the modes are right now?

2:52.3

If you had a pick from everything that you described, what do you think the main motes are that are still remaining? So this is cheating. There's a great book I read called Seven Powers. And so here are the moats that I remember, okay? Speed is actually not included in that book. It should be included, but there's seven, okay? One is brand. So Coca-Cola

3:08.5

would be the only left in marketing. Could be. Now, you have another one, switching costs. So you see

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