Welcome back to the place we find ourselves podcast. I'm Adam Young and this is part two of my interview with Cindy

Messmer. We are talking about intentionality. Let me begin by summarizing part one and then we'll return to my

conversation with Cindy. Last time Cindy and I talked about the importance of naming the intentionality of those who

harmed us. As you begin to engage your story and name the ways that for example your parents harmed you,

it is very common to think, okay I'll acknowledge that my dad harmed me but I don't think he really

meant to do it. I don't think my dad was trying to be cruel. He was just pretty oblivious and clueless

about how to relate to his daughter and Cindy and I want to respond to that sentiment by saying

uh really you really want to say that your dad was clueless and far more what we're wanting you to

grapple with is what would it cost you to believe that your father hurt you on purpose? What would it

cost you to believe that your mother said and did those things on purpose? As we pick up my conversation

with Cindy we are talking about the fact that parents have prompts every day. Prumps. We all have

prompts. For example the family is sitting at the dinner table and mom sees that her daughter is

very sad. The daughter is withdrawn quiet. When mom sees her daughter there is a prompt inside of mom

that says something is not right with your daughter. Why don't you ask her what is wrong?

Okay that's a prompt that's where we left off. Here's the rest of my conversation with Cindy.

So there are tons of ways to refuse to honor a prompt but I think three of the most common heart

mom can ignore. Yep. My daughter's face isn't sad. Totally. I'm just not going to look at it.

I'm going to look at her brother. Yep. Mom can minimize. The sorrow on her face is just because

like you said a boy didn't talk to her. Her heart's not really broken because something bad happened.

It's just it's minimizing or there can be accusation. She's too sensitive. Yep.

And I'm not going to engage it. Yeah. But I'm writing the narrative of she's too sensitive. That's

why her face has fallen. And all of a sudden this process of self deception begins to justify why mom

...