This is Jocco Podcast number 76 with Echo Charles and me Jocco Willink. Good evening, Echo.

Good evening. Freedom. That's something that you hear me talk about all the time. And I say

little things like don't take it for granted. And I say be thankful for your freedom. And I even say

things like you don't appreciate your freedom until it's gone. Pretty common statements you hear

from people. But how many of us have actually had our freedom taken away? And not metaphorically

speaking and not some self-imposed and thereby self-controlled way. And not in some way trapped by a

situation in our life that we don't have the courage to get out of. But I am talking about an

actual loss of freedom. Caged, controlled, starved, beaten, tortured. How long can you take that for?

But an hour, a day, what about a week or a month? What about a year? For six years.

What do you do? How do you survive? How do you get up every day and face the awful reality

that you live in? Darkness, fear, oppression. And how do you take that darkness and that fear

and that oppression and turn it into something good? Well, it is my honor today to have with us a man

that can answer those questions. Retired, Navy Captain, Charles Charlie Plum,

Naval Academy graduate, F-4 Phantom Fighter pilot, and prisoner of war,

Mid-North Vietnam for six years, six years.

Sir, it is an absolute honor to have you on and thank you so much for being here.

Thank you, Jack. It is a pleasure to be with you. Let's just start from the beginning

of Captain Charlie Plum. I know you are born wearing Indiana during World War II. My father was about

to be inducted and so he moved us to a little tiny town in Kansas where he thought my mother and I

had my big sister could live there while he went off to war. Well, as it turned out, he couldn't pass

the physical so he didn't go to war. But that is where I grew up in a tiny town in the middle of Kansas.

And I know you did, you went to work pretty at a pretty early age throwing papers.

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