meta_pixel
Tapesearch Logo
Log in
People I (Mostly) Admire

7. Caverly Morgan: "I Am Not This Voice. I Am Not This Narrative."

People I (Mostly) Admire

Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher

Society & Culture

4.62K Ratings

🗓️ 14 February 2026

⏱️ 39 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

She showed up late and confused to her first silent retreat, but Caverly Morgan eventually trained for eight years in silence at a Zen monastery. Now her mindfulness-education program Peace in Schools is part of the high-school curriculum in Portland, Ore. Steve Levitt finds out what daily life is like in a silent monastery, why teens find it easier than adults to learn meditation, and what happy children can teach their parents. This episode originally aired on November 13th, 2020.

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

A student of mine came to speak at a school board meeting.

0:05.8

I didn't know what he was going to say, but I've never forgotten it.

0:08.0

He said, mindful studies gave me the tools so I could save my life.

0:13.3

So these are the tools that give teens a very concrete way to move through the world with less suffering, with a deeper sense of knowing who they are and the capacity to deal with the inner critic, the voice that most of us don't ever even question.

0:32.5

I'm so excited to talk today with Cowherly Morgan. She's quite different than the typical guest I have in

0:38.2

this show, and that she's devoted her life to spirituality. She spent eight years living in complete silence

0:44.3

in a Zen Monastery, and since she left the monastery, she's done many interesting things, but the one that

0:49.4

really caught my attention is a program called Peace in Schools that teaches mindfulness skills to high school students.

0:55.8

I had a chance to observe that program firsthand, and I was so impressed that I immediately

1:00.0

signed up to be a donor. Welcome to people I mostly admire with Steve Levitt.

1:07.8

Now, I've only talked with Cavalry a few times at length, but I have to say, every time I walked away from the conversation, I felt changed, I felt improved, I felt happy.

1:18.3

So I really hope that today's conversation will be in that same spirit. I'm not quite sure, Calvally, how to introduce you.

1:37.9

So I just want to start with a story I've heard that I think says a lot about who you are.

1:42.4

You were leading a retreat retreat and a mosquito was buzzing

1:46.4

around you and you waved your hand, chewing the mosquito away, but it was persistent and it kept

1:52.4

on hovering around you. And this went on apparently for about 30 seconds. And then finally you just

1:57.1

said, oh, well, let's get this over with. And you stood still and the mosquito landed

2:02.3

on your cheek and it took a healthy dose of your blood until it finally was satisfied and it flew

2:08.9

away. And you went back to your lecture without any comment. Do you understand how unusual that

2:15.6

behavior is? Well, I've not even recalled that experience until you said it.

2:23.1

And I do recognize that what's unusual in our world today is for us to have such an interest in inquiry.

2:37.0

So when you say inquiry, I think most people wouldn't think of a mosquito sucking their blood as inquiry.

...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.

Copyright © Tapesearch 2026.