I'm Neil de Gras Tyson.

Hey I'm Adam Carolla.

Hi, my name is Pen Gillette.

Not only listening, I'm the guest.

I'm a pen in Teller, and I am the fourth listener.

And I am the fourth listener.

And that must make me at least the fourth listener.

To keep our three listeners coming back we must be doing something right and if you're

the fourth listener we thank you for the support you can get every episode with no ads at

Patreon.com slash David C. Smalley and take advantage of your fourth listener status

And we're going to sue David Smalley for slander. The world divided. It's time to resurrect nuance and remember the importance of conversation.

He's an actor. He's a comedian and he'll make you thank.

This is David C. Smalley.

Well, that's certainly the plan.

Well, that's certainly the plan. I mean I hope to make you think.

That's the idea behind all this. If I'm not making you think and you're just

sitting there drooling, go watch Spongebob or something, you know?

Think things through, man. That's the point. Being able to have

conversations with people that we disagree with is how we're going to move

forward in this world. You can't just put yourself in a bubble and think everyone's against you. You got to be willing to have these conversations and that's why this entire show was created. Welcome back to Dogma Debate. Damn it feels good to say that out loud.

All right. If you didn't see the news there is a brand new Dogma debate tier on the Patreon.

And so if you are at the $5 level or below,

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