Okay, thank you very much. All right, where did we got to start?

Well, you wanted the call, I'm happy to facilitate the topic that you want, so dive straight in.

All right, okay, so, yeah, so I mean, about a year ago I started in the Means Behavior Change Program, which unfortunately has on the Duluth model.

So I took a job in the integrated meds program,

sort of thinking that I'll be helping me because obviously you know I'm a

guy and you know and being through it in my life and I'm sort of be helping men but yeah I was told sort of early on that it's not really poor men it's to to help women and children as it relates to family violence.

So it runs on the Duluth model.

Are you familiar with the Duluth model?

I am not.

Okay, so the Duluth model runs on power and control.

So it's kind of the standard model that runs through the police and subsequent social services

as to relates to family violence and it's sort of related all to power and control and the patriarchy.

I'm not sure what that would mean in terms of how things would play out in

conflicts. Okay so basically I'm mostly mean to get referred through to my program

we're mostly our referrals from corrections so they had in an

a incident with the police or through the courts and some of self-referals though as well.

So generally speaking, as people get referred through to the program,

they have to run through this model,

it runs through the power and control.

So generally speaking, it's always taken at the outset that the man is at fault as it relates to family violence.

Which is. as it relates to family violence, which is sometimes a case but not always. So we kind of have to have to run through that frame and most of the men that come through the program generally they engage with

the material often as the victim and it's difficult because we kind of have to reframe it because we still have to push back on

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