This is John Batchel, speaking to colleague Anatole Levin of the Quincy Institute,

about what it appears to be the Russian frustration with America's participation in the Ukraine war.

The Ukrainians are striking at war nodes, refineries, factories making gunpowder,

and with Tomahawk missiles, they can strike

at Moscow itself, especially the drone factories. However, none of this would be possible, I learned

from the Wall Street Journal reporting, without U.S. targeting, intelligence gathering from the

satellites and other sources. In other words, the U.S. is in the war.

It's telling Keef where to shoot. Otherwise, Keefe would be blind. What does this mean about

Russia's opinion of the war? Anatole fills us in on what the Russians say to themselves,

especially the hardliners, about the war in Ukraine. Much more of this tonight.

Well, that's precisely it. And this is what, of course, the hardliners in Russia say again and again.

You know, America is basically targeting us, or the West is targeting us. We have to target them.

Now, Putin has so far, you know, resisted that because,

of course, for Russia directly to target the West in return would be hideously dangerous

and would certainly lead to radical escalation. But the hardliners, of course, in Russia say, well, but this is a way of

terrifying the West into actually, you know, forcing the Ukrainians to make peace on our terms.

An extremely dangerous argument, which as I say, Putin has so far resisted. I was told, though,

that in Russia, by the vast majority of people I talked to, that if the

West were to begin the escalation, you know, by shooting down Russian aircraft that entered

NATO airspace or by seizing Russian cargoes on the high seas, then Putin would have to retaliate

directly and immediately,

precisely because a lot of people in Russia feel that, you know, they've had enough.

...