meta_pixel
Tapesearch Logo
Log in
Lex Fridman Podcast

#474 – DHH: Future of Programming, AI, Ruby on Rails, Productivity & Parenting

Lex Fridman Podcast

Lex Fridman

Philosophy, Society & Culture, Science, Technology

4.7 β€’ 13K Ratings

πŸ—“οΈ 12 July 2025

⏱️ 375 minutes

🧾️ Download transcript

Summary

David Heinemeier Hansson (aka DHH) is a legendary programmer, creator of Ruby on Rails, co-owner & CTO of 37signals that created Basecamp, HEY, & ONCE, and is a NYT-best-selling author (with Jason Fried) of 4 books: REWORK, REMOTE, Getting Real, and It Doesn't Have To Be Crazy At Work. He is also a race car driver, including a class-winning performance at the 24 hour Le Mans race.
Thank you for listening ❀ Check out our sponsors: https://lexfridman.com/sponsors/ep474-sc
See below for timestamps, transcript, and to give feedback, submit questions, contact Lex, etc.

Transcript:
https://lexfridman.com/dhh-david-heinemeier-hansson-transcript

CONTACT LEX:
Feedback - give feedback to Lex: https://lexfridman.com/survey
AMA - submit questions, videos or call-in: https://lexfridman.com/ama
Hiring - join our team: https://lexfridman.com/hiring
Other - other ways to get in touch: https://lexfridman.com/contact

EPISODE LINKS:
DHH's X: https://x.com/dhh
DHH's Website: https://dhh.dk/
Ruby on Rails: https://rubyonrails.org/
37signals: https://37signals.com/

DHH's books:
Rework: https://amzn.to/44rSKob
Remote: https://amzn.to/44GFJ91
It Doesn't Have to Be Crazy at Work: https://amzn.to/46bzuwx
Getting Real: https://amzn.to/4kzoMDg

SPONSORS:
To support this podcast, check out our sponsors & get discounts:
UPLIFT Desk: Standing desks and office ergonomics.
Go to https://upliftdesk.com/lex
Lindy: No-code AI agent builder.
Go to https://go.lindy.ai/lex
LMNT: Zero-sugar electrolyte drink mix.
Go to https://drinkLMNT.com/lex
Shopify: Sell stuff online.
Go to https://shopify.com/lex
NetSuite: Business management software.
Go to http://netsuite.com/lex

OUTLINE:
(00:00) - Introduction
(00:58) - Sponsors, Comments, and Reflections
(08:48) - Programming - early days
(26:13) - JavaScript
(36:32) - Google Chrome and DOJ
(44:19) - Ruby programming language
(51:30) - Beautiful code
(1:09:31) - Metaprogramming
(1:12:52) - Dynamic typing
(1:20:10) - Scaling
(1:33:03) - Future of programming
(1:50:34) - Future of AI
(1:56:29) - Vibe coding
(2:05:01) - Rails manifesto: Principles of a great programming language
(2:29:27) - Why managers are useless
(2:38:48) - Small teams
(2:44:55) - Jeff Bezos
(3:00:13) - Why meetings are toxic
(3:07:58) - Case against retirement
(3:15:15) - Hard work
(3:20:53) - Why we left the cloud
(3:24:04) - AWS
(3:33:22) - Owning your own servers
(3:39:35) - Elon Musk
(3:49:17) - Apple
(4:01:03) - Tim Sweeney
(4:12:37) - Fatherhood
(4:38:19) - Racing
(5:05:23) - Cars
(5:10:41) - Programming setup
(5:25:51) - Programming language for beginners
(5:39:09) - Open source
(5:48:01) - WordPress drama
(5:59:18) - Money and happiness
(6:08:11) - Hope

Transcript

Click on a timestamp to play from that location

0:00.0

The following is a conversation with David Heinemeyer Hansen, also known as DHHH.

0:06.0

He is a legend in the programming and tech world, brilliant and insightful, sometimes controversial,

0:13.2

and always fun to talk to.

0:15.4

He's the creator of Ruby on Rails, which is an influential web development framework

0:20.3

behind many websites used by

0:22.1

millions of people, including Shopify, GitHub, and Airbnb. He is the co-owner and CTO of 37

0:30.4

signals that created Basecamp, Hay, and Once. He is a New York Times bestselling author, together with his co-author, Jason Freed, of four books.

0:42.8

Rework, remote, getting real, and it doesn't have to be crazy at work.

0:48.6

And on top of that, he's also a race car driver, including being a class winner at the legendary 24-hour

0:55.5

Le Mans race.

0:58.4

And now, a quick few second mention of a sponsor.

1:01.6

Check them out in the description or at lexfidman.com slash sponsors.

1:05.9

It's the best way to support this podcast.

1:08.4

We got a couple of new sponsors, actually, so please go support them.

1:11.8

Uplift Desk for beautiful workspaces, Lindy for building AI agents, Element for hydration,

1:18.6

Shopify for selling stuff online, and NetSuite for your business. Choose Wise and my friends.

1:24.3

And now on to the full adderies. I do try to make them interesting, but if you skip,

1:28.7

please still check out our sponsors. I enjoy their stuff. Maybe you will too. To get in touch

1:33.1

with me for whatever reason, go to Lexfremma.com slash contact. All right, let's go. This episode is

1:39.2

brought to you by Uplift Desk. Like I mentioned, it's a new sponsor, but I've been using them for many,

1:43.8

many years. I have six, it's a new sponsor, but I've been using them for many, many years.

1:44.6

I have six uplift desks. So three of them are in the podcast studio. So across many years, I don't

...

Please login to see the full transcript.

Disclaimer: The podcast and artwork embedded on this page are from Lex Fridman, and are the property of its owner and not affiliated with or endorsed by Tapesearch.

Generated transcripts are the property of Lex Fridman and are distributed freely under the Fair Use doctrine. Transcripts generated by Tapesearch are not guaranteed to be accurate.

Copyright Β© Tapesearch 2025.